Border Services probe nets 800 illegal replica guns, 78 criminal charges

[Drake]

Originally Posted by Daviday

one idea is to show the public airsoft and prove it`s not as dangours like most think, and it would defently raise questions, but it would show to the govnerment that we care about the sport at the leaset.

You might want to just search for and read up on the past 50 times all of this has been brought up.

[Daviday]

i have , and ya i`ll get over the fact that the govnerment will succsed one day....

[Dracheous]

Originally Posted by Gunk

We could pay for it. (granted I'm sure there are hidden costs and angles and reasons I can't possibly think of right now)

I mean, if people in Ontario have to pay for their own sex change operations...

Oh... wait....

Well you already pay to get your PAL be it non-restricted or restricted. It still becomes a cost, just look at "Registry", that costed us $2billion, however when it FIRST came out there was a charge to register your fire-arm; IF I recall it was $40 per long arm. There will be costs, simply having to add training programs to CFC employees to know/understand such new provisions for airsoft would have to take affect.

Really, the only way to get airsoft out of the "evils of the public eye" IS to create a REGULATED system, and that would most definitely have to be government controlled ONE way or another. Tagging onto the existing PAL system does seem like a great idea but am sure there would be blow backs because of it. For one, the general consensus amongst real steel shooters is that airsoft is bad for public image; and when you think of it they DO got a point. We are a bunch of "grown" men dressing up and going out to play "Soldier" like we did with sticks back in the day. But now, we've started investing in our sticks and gear to mimic the REAL thing. Then you have things like how that terrorist "cell" got caught right here in Ontario not to many years back; "Neighbors noticed large groups of men showing up regularly to the area dressed in camouflage, and distant sounds that 'sounded' like gun fire." So based on a bunch of guys showing up dressed in woodlands all the time and add in "sounds" that "sounded" like gun fire, not someone saying "Hey that IS gun fire" it was, "was that gunfire?" Such mistakes CAN be made with our guns, specially with illusions people have with "Silencers" from the movies for instance.


Again, for now the better option might actually to let Airsoft die, sort of. Think of it this way, all NEW gun sources dry up, but you still have ORGANIZED groups meeting once a month or so to put together a game or two for FUN. Say a year from now better regs make it more cross the board and everyone's playing with the same guns they have been for a couple seasons now because they don't have much choice. The game continues even when it has no room to grow, and there MAY be sight of something for which the public can capitalize on. Similar to the way Paintball died ((sorta, not as heavy as Airsoft probably will)) to come back to the public eye as a GAME that people do and WILL play for fun. It always comes back to how long before you police something that you either irracticate completely or regulate so that it STAYS safe. ((Prostitutions to Escorts comes to mind as a PERFECT example, though that did take a couple centuries :P)).

Then there's the back lash, people still see a bunch of GROWN men dressed in camo showing up to play war; which looks very much like para-military training NOT conducted by licensed and certified personnel.




Would I pay to have another bit on my PAL to keep airsoft going? Yes.

Pro's-

Regulate import
Regulate acquisition
Regulate AGE of owners
Assist in Regulating cross the board regs for the game

Con's-

Public might still not accept it
No ability to "register" the devices
Costs are unknown
Who are we going to get to put this through Commons?

I want to emphasize this last con. The Liberal party won't back INCREASING access to "fire-arm" related devices, and the Conservatives will not risk any of their seats with the up-coming election because the general public is not for increasing access to "fire-arm" related devices. And no one else will have the seats to even fart the idea at the House.

[Gunk]

You take all the fun out of things sometimes

The security industry in Ontario just changed in a manner not unlike your PAL thought... the Ministry blended Private investigators and Security guards together into one license. I pay another $80 and I get a PI license on top of my guard license.

So the precedent is there, and there's a template the PAL system could adopt and adapt.

And I'm sure people in charge of regulating and knowing the PAL system take training courses regularly (at work there's almost a course a month I have to sit in on. Different industry, but still), so I don't know how much work/money it'd take to incorporate an Airsoft recognition program into the PAL thing, but I can't see it being a shit ton.

PAL
PALR
PALA

Palo smells funny....

But this has been discussed to death I'm sure...

[jesster202]

Ok i know im not old timer like some of you guy's here. But i have been in the sport long enough to see the last 2 major public distributors fall (the late a and a and some what kinda dead 007) hell i bought from both. since i have started to buy collect and keep and even sell off some, airsoft has been incresingly growing. its now moved form clear plastic shit sold at wall mart to being retailed in some stores around were i live with only painted tip's shure their is a lot of contrversy over the whole bit. I'm also not saying its a bitch to get new guns but form the last 6 months or so iv seen more and more non clear guns go up for sale on store fronts and even no publicly retailed on sites shure not tm or ca or ka .ect but it is a start im shure it will get harder as the year goes on but im a strong beliver "it allways gets harder befour it gets easyer" im confident to say that this sport wont die over night it will take some time to turn (for lack of a better refernce paintball) and not lose its true ways as a military type sport just gain more notice in the media in a postive way. thats how i feel so dont shit on me for having my own view on this.

[ThePUNISHER]

Originally Posted by Gunk

You take all the fun out of things sometimes

The security industry in Ontario just changed in a manner not unlike your PAL thought... the Ministry blended Private investigators and Security guards together into one license. I pay another $80 and I get a PI license on top of my guard license.

They have always been "blended" together. You used to have to pay for both as well. The only difference is that they would change it from saying Security Guard to Security Guard/Private Investigator. Just wait until next year when they bring out the mandatory training programs. There is going to be a severe shortage of security in this province but at least the remaining security will be ok trained.

[Gunk]

Really? I musta read the article wrong then. I thought there was still some seperation between the two until August. I figured it was the same industry more or less, and I think I remember now about the license thing... but I thought there was more to it than just newfangled pretty licenses, more training, and more cost to renew those licenses. I thought there was some sort of unification or blending that happened along with that.

[Proteus]

May 29, 2008
Discussion Topic: Toronto Mayor Targets Gun Clubs
He also has gun manufacturers in his sights. In fact, he’s pretty much after the whole shooting match.

From the Toronto Sun:

Mayor David Miller is turning his sights on shooting clubs and gun manufacturers.

The mayor, who last month called for a national handgun ban, said yesterday he supports new recommendations to shut down two gun clubs that operate out of city-run facilities.

The recommendations . . . also call for a new zoning bylaw to restrict the use of firing ranges to the police, military and provincial and federal governments.

The bylaw would "prohibit establishments that manufacture, assemble, warehouse and/or distribute guns."

Your reaction?

**************************





When the Nazis came for the communists,
I remained silent;
I was not a communist.
When they locked up the social democrats,
I remained silent;
I was not a social democrat.
When they came for the trade unionists,
I did not speak out;
I was not a trade unionist.
When they came for the Jews,
I did not speak out;
I was not a Jew.
When they came for me, there was no one left to speak out.

Friedrich Gustav Martin Niemöller's words, uttered more than 50 years ago.

[Tex]

what you just heard of this "news" now?

[Dracheous]

Originally Posted by Tex

what you just heard of this "news" now?

No, he simply seems to be trying to offer a "remedy" by suggesting we all band together to save those gun clubs. What he's missing is were not talking about a dictator that is systematically weaving together new orders that will take orders only from him and not the public. But we are talking about a group that reports TO the public who HAS made the demand that replicas be made illegal, that these gun clubs be shut down, etc etc. His quote offers little relevance here, and while yes it is a great quote and should never be forgotten, it was written about a completely different kind of event/process.

[insert]

Originally Posted by ShortCut

Not good.... What are the chances of someone comming here, looking for ones sold? If they did come they wouldnt be able to see the classifieds, because they are not age verified right? or do they have a way of "Bypassing" that?

forums usually dont have insane protection, and someone semi-knowledgeable on the subject could easily hack a simple usergroup restriction and see all parts of the forum. I am sure that canadian law enforcement has a few people on hte payroll...


but the chances that they will actually use them for this? pssshhhffffttt, i doubt it, they must have bigger and better things to worry about.

[Proteus]

Whether the media information on airsoft is accurate or not, it is all about public perception of what imitation/replica guns might be capable of.

Have a look in the UK and see what is occuring there. This is just a blog and there are many other articles you can also find.

http://www.att-tactical.com/blog/?p=53

[tony123]

Originally Posted by Shrapnel[Op-For]

I'll never understand why a kid (with a parent) could easily choose from large variety of pellet guns that could potentially severally harm someone MUCH more than an airsoft gun ever could. BUT if he wanted an airsoft gun that shoots 250 fps, it would be harder to get a hold of because it looks real.



Oh and by the way... ever notice that airsoft is spell checked as a typo even though this is an airsoft site?.... OH NO SECRET SPY TAMPERING WITH THE SERVER?

The fact that even pelet guns these days are becomeing more real, take the crosman t4 for example http://crosman.com/site/listing/1325 , i can buy one at my local canadian tire and from a few feet away unless your trained your never going to know the difference between that and a real or airsoft glock, but yet anyone 18 has access.