Elitists -Newbies, please read

[m102404]

I'd say I'm more of the moderate ones out there...

...good luck on an Internet forum buddy.

Originally Posted by takatsu

Well, it's been a while since the last reply in this thread, so sorry for bumping it! Thanks for the read, although, I've completely agreed and known about these issues between starters/newbie and experienced/serious airsoft players.

I am a complete newb (although I've been fooling around with a crappy $50 Umarex HK USP NBB CO2 pistol) and am looking to get into airsoft seriously, and therefore as any person with common sense would, I have done months of research, reading almost every possible post on here.

I know the rules, I know the gear needed, I know what events require what, I know which brands are better, which are worse. I have a full time job and am willing to spend some dough. Although I can't see the classifieds as I'm still awaiting replies from age verifiers or looking for space in my schedule to join an event and get AV'd.

However, I must say sometimes it's been quite discouraging personally to be reading all these threads (not specifically saying this one) on airsoft canada. To me, recommending more expensive (rather, reasonably priced) products isn't an issue. But I'd like to be honest and express that I'm not feeling very comfortable because of the harsher attitudes/tones that most experienced players have. Sometimes those starting out may feel intimidated because of that, rather than the recommendation of expensive equipment. To me, that is more "elitism", where it feels like it is an elite society that we cannot get into because we are shot down - no pun intended - whatever we say or do. I'm sure that comes from having to deal with ignorant noobs all the time but still.

Not that I have ever experienced that personally, but I wince reading posts on asc alot of times. However, that doesn't change my determination or seriousness in getting into it, getting to know all of you and joining events and making new friends and comrades. I've seen so many videos online with footage from games and off the field. I talk to some serious airsofters. People are awesome out there in real life.

But hey, would it be possible to create a more welcoming atmosphere on ASC and just ignore the ignorant noobs (or just post a link to a thread with an answer) who don't read shit. (I mean i've read posts where information was repeated a billion times to different people)

I'm in no position to say this (since i just joined the site) but just getting my opinion out there as a newb and the atmosphere I feel.

Anyway, but one day I'll probably become one of those more experienced players haha!

[takatsu]

lol no worries. Just putting out that notion out there. I'm not saying everyone is like that. I'm just talking in general, even on online communities - of course we've all been in other online forums for many years - there are just nicer ways of saying things when we're not the ones being personally insulted and I'm certain most of us are actually super cool in real life and on field. When a committed newbie comes in, although it may not turn us away from airsoft (if it does then that's our loss right) but it makes ASC seem unwelcoming, when in reality it isn't. I've seen really funny and epic posts here, so why misrepresent the community to someone looking to start out? I don't think it's an elitist community. As with any hobby with passionate people, don't we want to encourage and educate newcomers. Everybody even ignorant noobs will respond better with positive culture

[kalnaren]

Originally Posted by takatsu

However, I must say sometimes it's been quite discouraging personally to be reading all these threads (not specifically saying this one) on airsoft canada. To me, recommending more expensive (rather, reasonably priced) products isn't an issue. But I'd like to be honest and express that I'm not feeling very comfortable because of the harsher attitudes/tones that most experienced players have. Sometimes those starting out may feel intimidated because of that, rather than the recommendation of expensive equipment. To me, that is more "elitism", where it feels like it is an elite society that we cannot get into because we are shot down - no pun intended - whatever we say or do. I'm sure that comes from having to deal with ignorant noobs all the time but still.

T7 summed it up on one of his posts early in this thread.

The vast majority of new posters on ASC come here with some preconceived notion of what airsoft is, how much it should cost, etc. etc. Most of the answers these newbs get is a blunt -not necessarily impolite- "No. This is the way it is: ____". The newb then proceeds to go off on the kind of rant that inspired my OP.

If you want to see how bad it was getting, go review some posts from 2007-2008, or earlier. I can recall one post specifically where a new member was asking where they could get an M14 for $200. Despite being consistently told that no such thing existed (an M14 in 08 was running around $600+), said member and some other newbies who came out of the woodwork proceeded to call us elitist assholes because we wouldn't recommend to them a cheap M14 (which didn't exist). A lot of older members have gone through this over and over and over and over. Heck, I've only been here 5 years and I remember this stuff, how do you think guys who have been at this for 10+ feel? Could we just ignore the thread? Sure, but honestly if someone takes the time to write a decent question, I don't really have an issue taking some time to answer it. It's not my fault they get hissy when they get an answer they don't like.

Likewise, I remember another post where a newbie was arguing that they had the right to come out to a game in a t-shirt without bothering to wear BDUs because they didn't have the money to drop on them. They were arguing that we should be lowering our standards to allow them into games because they couldn't afford the kit. People like that have absolutely zero concept that they're playing a team game, and frankly, we don't want people like that in the game. So yea, they will get a rather hostile reception.

There's a nice little saying I like: My personality is who I am. My attitude depends on who YOU are.

There are a lot of examples of new guys coming and asking good questions and getting good answers. Where they run into issues is failing to realize the ASC community is very intolerant of laziness, immaturity, and stupidity. A few days spent browsing and searching the forum would tell them this.

There's also another thing I should point out: ASC isn't airsoft in Canada. It's the ASC forum community, nothing more, nothing less. Our #1 advice to people has ALWAYS been to go to a game and meet people face to face. Again, for some reasons, a lot of newbies don't seem to like that answer. And again, too bad, not our problem.

But hey, would it be possible to create a more welcoming atmosphere on ASC and just ignore the ignorant noobs (or just post a link to a thread with an answer) who don't read shit. (I mean i've read posts where information was repeated a billion times to different people)

Newbs don't read. Simple as that. There are TONS of threads where people post links to answers.

I'm in no position to say this (since i just joined the site) but just getting my opinion out there as a newb and the atmosphere I feel.

Stick around for a couple of months and you'll be fine.

[wildcard]

+1
Unfortunately newbies are quick shoot down any advice that is different than what they want to believe, that is why most of the older player here rather give advice and tips on the field over the computer and when the tolerance level for nub ignorance went down that is when the famous ASC hate machine comes out, followed by Drake's famous ban hammer, which i find very entertaining. want a good laugh just go to the trash bin plenty of facepalm threads.

[takatsu]

lol okay, fair enough, for those who don't read, or are underaged! then, what can we say. I just was getting the feeling that it's for any starting out.

Well, cheers, and looking forward to getting into the combat zone and some holes put in me >

[kalnaren]

It's not that we don't like newbies. I actually rather enjoy teaming up with new players at games. They're usually quite motivated with a good attitude. But those newbies also tend to ask informed questions.

You can really tell when someone takes some time to research by the question they asked. Someone who's informed will be able to ask the type of question that will lead to the answer they require. Even if it does seem like a more basic question, which honestly most of us don't mind answering. For example, someone asking "Hey guys this part is broken, I think it's the tappet plate. This is a V2 mechbox right? How do I fix it?" vs. "hey guys my gun won't shoot I don't know what type of mechbox it has halp!!11!!!11"

Big, big difference. And the only thing that's really different effort wise is 20 minutes on Google.

For example, a search of "TM M16 cycles but won't shoot BBs" and 20 minutes of reading will inform you of 3 things: The M16 has a V2 mechbox, the problem is nozzle/tappet plate/hop-up, or your mags aren't feeding properly. Another 10 minutes will tell you how to diagnose those. Then you can come here and say "Hey guys, my M16 won't shoot. It cycles and I've eliminated the following _____. I think this is the problem ____. Advice?"

I don't know a single person on ASC who'd give that question a snarky, sarcastic, or douchebag answer. If the problem is more specific or "special", then we start troubleshooting and everyone involved might learn something. THAT is the way a forum should be used.

[Curo]

Speaking of Drake, who can forget the now iconic Troll Crusher 1-1?

[Brian McIlmoyle]

Originally Posted by takatsu

lol okay, fair enough, for those who don't read, or are underaged! then, what can we say. I just was getting the feeling that it's for any starting out.

Well, cheers, and looking forward to getting into the combat zone and some holes put in me >

Regardless of what community one tries to enter.. at first you will be an outsider, you will lack the knowledge and language to be welcomed.

Breaking into the community IS daunting.. you will feel like everyone on the inside is trying to keep you out.

The mistake is to try to make your entry here on a forum.. this place is NOT the airsoft community.. this is simply a clearing house for information and communication.

The community exists at games and events .. that is where you will be welcomed as a new player, where people will help you and break their backs to see you get a good start. It is also where you can prove your interest , and commitment.

You can type a thousand words on a forum.. it means nothing.. you're still just some NOOB who says he wants to get involved.

Show up at a few games.. and meet some people in person and you will be "in" practically instantly.

[haven.hatty]

I know the rules, I know the gear needed, I know what events require what, I know which brands are better, which are worse. I have a full time job and am willing to spend some dough. Although I can't see the classifieds as I'm still awaiting replies from age verifiers or looking for space in my schedule to join an event and get AV'd.

[AirsoftChewy]

Originally Posted by Brian McIlmoyle

For every one of the stupid gits who listen to other stupid gits and end up with crap guns...

there are about 6 new guys lurking.. listening... reading.. researching and getting involved and setting out on the right foot.

it's easy to paint all new players with the same brush.. but in my experience its not really the case.

To a degree... here on ASC the idiots are running the asylum ... but it is not representative of the community at large.

I bump into new players all the time who practically never post here.. but none the less glean most of their info from here.. winnowing the wheat from the chaffe. The typically end up well kitted and prepared ...

Thank you Brian!

I've been to two games. One was a 'vets' game. The other a 'high school group' game. Had no idea or I may not of gone.

I've already spent close to $1400 on equipment. You wouldn't know it cuz I show up with the box the gun was bought in.

This is a fantastic sport. Like every sport there are those who have that 'jock' attitude and those who are actual real humans who just love the sport and want to help on occasion. I'll take the advice from those who just want to help.

I'm sure there are lots of 'newbs' who are like some of you are saying. But that is like saying all Russian immigrants are criminals. It's sadly and grossly wrong. Period.

From my POV - I show up at a CQB event at adrenaline paintball, my first game ever, not knowing what to expect, not knowing a single person, feeling a little socially uncomfortable to start with, get shoved around a bit, shot at too close a range more than once with mercy rule in effect (within 5-10 feet - those shotguns really hurt), shot multiple times after yelling 'HIT' and holding up my weapon, shot point blank in the face in the 'safe zone' and got zapped more than once on full auto in a semi auto only environment.

This was 'vets' night, not the 'highschool' night. Highschool night was actually a little more fun, more laid back, though I am almost 2x the age of the players that night and really didn't enjoy the quality of the gaming, but at least I got to try my new gun site out.

So, ya, some of you vets, your just so awesome. Thanks for the warm welcome. Good thing I'm NOT taking the example laid out for me as the way this sport works in general. And shame on you for the shoddy treatment of a new player, who is doing his time to figure this shit out.

I've already learned how to swap springs, change hop ups and barrels, modify the guns in general and proper care. I'd probably have a vest as well but thought full face protection a better buy with funds draining due to buying what are supposed to be quality guns. Before the vest I'll be buying boots. So ya, next week, when I show up again on Vet's night, I'll be the guy in the hoody and jeans with full face and boots.

Shake your heads at me if you like.

Or better yet, try shaking my hand.

[Curo]

Well If I was you I wouldn't have bought 2 guns before the vest. But thats just cause I like having somewhere to put my shit. Having 2 guns is a bonus cause if one goes down the other is a back up. Pick up a Double rifle case ASAP though, they are a crazy useful.

[AirsoftChewy]

Originally Posted by Cobalt Caliber

Well If I was you I wouldn't have bought 2 guns before the vest. But thats just cause I like having somewhere to put my shit. Having 2 guns is a bonus cause if one goes down the other is a back up. Pick up a Double rifle case ASAP though, they are a crazy useful.

Thanks Cobalt!

I was told these things break down, just a fact of the game, so I took that to heart knowing anything with moving parts will eventually break. I also looked hard into learning the internals and how it all works together, so if something does happen I am ready with tools on hand to get it repaired or at the very least diagnosed ASAP so I can get back on the field

Loving the KA M4, metal internals as well externals - great value and thanks to all those who pushed me in that direction.

[ThunderCactus]

nobody should feel bad about being new. I know some guys that have been playing regularly for over 4 years, they're still noobs lol

[Ricochet]

Sounds like you've taken a good step forward. If your serious about doing your own maintenance, upgrades, etc; find an experienced gun doc to show you the finer points of quality, shimming, etc. Do yourself a favor, and buy "quality" gear. "Buy cheap, buy twice"; is a good ol' ASC moto. Sometimes it's buy three, four times.

Sorry to hear your first "serious" game didn't go smooth. It is a sport where mistakes do get made, by everyone. And you numb yourself to BB hits over time. Except knuckles, ears, nose, etc.

[AirsoftChewy]

Originally Posted by Ricochet

Sounds like you've taken a good step forward. If your serious about doing your own maintenance, upgrades, etc; find an experienced gun doc to show you the finer points of quality, shimming, etc. Do yourself a favor, and buy "quality" gear. "Buy cheap, buy twice"; is a good ol' ASC moto. Sometimes it's buy three, four times.

Sorry to hear your first "serious" game didn't go smooth. It is a sport where mistakes do get made, by everyone. And you numb yourself to BB hits over time. Except knuckles, ears, nose, etc.

Great advice, thanks! Ya by the end of the day it was more of a 'here we go again' type feeling when the full auto or cheap shots came raining down.

BUT, I know that the place I went too isn't really the best representation of the sport, by far, they even sold me a used charger that is now not working after only charging 2 batteries. 7.4 Lipos. So, I will go back again to test some things I've changed out, but really I'm looking for a team of mature players who milsim a bit and are willing to take on a non-military background individual who just wants to get in and get dirty.