Ares G36v: a word of caution

[GBBR]

All the Ares I've seen has XYZ gearsets inside. never have I worked on a customer's gun and found S&T gearsets inside.

the only S&T G36 gearbox I worked on had S&T stamped on the gearset

[pestobanana]

Originally Posted by Styrak

S&T is an OEM for ARES, so the guns are S&T/ARES. They're not lying to you. I have S&T/ARES G36C's instock as well.

They're probably made in the same factory, but there is a distinct difference in quality between S&T and Ares. The S&T is made of obviously shittier material, you don't even have to open the gearbox to see. There is also a notable price difference when retailers carry both. AirsoftMegaStore sells the Ares for almost twice as much as the S&T.

Also what GBBR said, the one I worked on had S&T stamped on the gearset. So yes, TA did lie to my friend who bought it.

[Kratisto]

The G36 EBB with collapsible stock ("V") are not made by Ares.

For reference:

STAR G36 - TM clone. H&K and "STAR AIRSOFT" markings. Gearbox with quick change spring and microswitch.
ARES G36 - Same as above, but with 3 steel body pins instead of screws. H&K, but no "STAR AIRSOFT" markings.
ARES G36 EBB (early)- All new real steel style body, barrel and stock disassembly. Electric blowback. H&K markings.
ARES G36 EBB (current)- Same as above. Ventilated pistol grip plate base. No H&K markings.

UMAREX G36 EBB (early) - Rebranded ARES G36 EBB with H&K markings.
UMAREX G36V EBB (early) - S&T clone of ARES G36 EBB design with collapsible stock, and laser H&K markings.
UMAREX G36V EBB (current) - Same as above, with engraved H&K markings.
UMAREX G36C (Sportline) - S&T, same design with no EBB or collapsible stock. Made of ABS plastic.
UMAREX G36C, G36K GBBR - Made by VFC. Perfect copy of real steel G36 body and parts. Not a clone or compatible with other airsoft G36.

WE G39C GBBR - Clone of ARES G36 EBB body externals with WE GBBR internals.

[Kos-Mos]

Originally Posted by Kratisto

The G36 EBB with collapsible stock ("V") are not made by Ares.

For reference:

STAR G36 - TM clone. H&K and "STAR AIRSOFT" markings. Gearbox with quick change spring and microswitch.
ARES G36 - Same as above, but with 3 steel body pins instead of screws. H&K, but no "STAR AIRSOFT" markings.
ARES G36 EBB (early)- All new real steel style body, barrel and stock disassembly. Electric blowback. H&K markings.
ARES G36 EBB (current)- Same as above. Ventilated pistol grip plate base. No H&K markings.

UMAREX G36 EBB (early) - Rebranded ARES G36 EBB with H&K markings.
UMAREX G36V EBB (early) - S&T clone of ARES G36 EBB design with collapsible stock, and laser H&K markings.
UMAREX G36V EBB (current) - Same as above, with engraved H&K markings.
UMAREX G36C (Sportline) - S&T, same design with no EBB or collapsible stock. Made of ABS plastic.
UMAREX G36C, G36K GBBR - Made by VFC. Perfect copy of real steel G36 body and parts. Not a clone or compatible with other airsoft G36.

WE G39C GBBR - Clone of ARES G36 EBB body externals with WE GBBR internals.

WTF? Just no.

Also, the STAR G36s didn't use microswitches. They used regular V3 trigger components, but the top pin that holds it in place is a bit lower than normal, so you need to enlarge the little hole to install aftermarket triggers. It's when ARES ditched STAR and branded their own rifles that they started using microswitches (and they should have stayed with normal stuff).

[lurkingknight]

I always thought s&t was arer's sportline brand

[Kratisto]

Maybe very early STAR guns used standard gearboxes, I don't know. But in all the old reviews of STAR guns still on the Internet, and the guns I've seen first hand myself (SL9, SL8, M4A1, G36C, L85A2), their gearboxes came with quick change spring guides and microswitchs. Note that there is another unrelated company called "Star": Star Rainbow Company, AKA "SRC".

Yes, WE's G39C are external clones of ARES EBB. Of course they are not identical, there are internal changes for the GBB parts. But if you look closely at the externals, there are several details totally unique to STAR/ARES/S&T G36Cs shared by WE (and not others like TM, CA, SRC, KWA...):

*UMP "notch and hole" type rear sight (should be G36C 2 hole type). STAR made the UMP before the G36C, and they just recycled the part.
*UMP type 4 bullets in auto fire pictogram ( should be 5 in G36s). Same as above.
*Concave stock rubber end pad ( should be rounded in shorter G36C type stock). STAR made the full size G36 before the G36C, and they just recycled the part.
*Incorrect and unique side rails (should be... different)
*Oval stock hinge ( should be round ). With the new ARES EBB body, the stock hinge is shaped in a way that makes airsoft stocks not compatible with real G36s.
*Exposed barrel trunnion. In a real G36 (or the VFC 36 GBB) this is covered, and a special tool is necessary to dissamble the barrel. Airsoft G36 have this part exposed for more battery space.

It's plain clear that WE copied the ARES EBB body and modified it. It's not a copy of TM style externals or real G36s (Only the Umarex/VFC G36C is)

[Yuu]

That piston is probably from the latest g36 from ares; early version of g36 had a way better one than later production.

Originally Posted by lurkingknight

I'm just going to come in and comment on this. I have a client gun on my bench a tan ares g36c with KV stock. The piston is the exact same color. The gearbox was previously unopened, I broke the seal, so that piston was factory installed. No bearing in it either.

[forge]

Wow, lots of great information for the masses being posted here

For the record, my gun had intact seals, and did not in any way appear to be futzed around with. While I am disappointed in how TA chose to handle the failure, as a business I respect their decision. Up to this point, I have never had any trouble with TA, even when I had to return a couple of items (both without incident). I file this whole thing under "dumb on my part" and have moved on... (granted, SOME form of "gesture in kind" from TA would have been appreciated).

Now that THAT's out of the way... the gears have no stamps/markings on them, the gearbox seals were intact, and overall the gearbox was nicely (but not perfectly) assembled/shimmed. I don't think anything was built or put together poorly except for the piston, which I think suffered from a casting defect or similar flaw.
The gun is now back together, having had a Lonex piston, hop up, and shim set installed; and is now in the final stages of tuning Anyone have some experience with a Lonex hop up in an Ares G36? This thing is a bit of a b**ch to install/tune...

As always, thanks for the feedback guys and gals.

[KenTsui]

Originally Posted by forge

Anyone have some experience with a Lonex hop up in an Ares G36? This thing is a bit of a b**ch to install/tune...

No, but I have a ProWin that fits perfectly.




Isn't the Lonex one similar?

[lurkingknight]

installed a lonex hop into someone's ares just a couple weeks ago.. it is a bitch to tune. As are most hop up units for g36s it seems. Air seal on it is an issue, as well as feeding after I addressed the air seal issue. Haven't gotten the gun back to tweak the feeding or to try another hopup unit I have laying around. owner hamfisted the original back in and broke it, as well as a replacement unit that's when he called me lol.

[forge]

I am having multiple issues with the Lonex hop up unit: double-feeding (particularly on semi-auto), jams, and poor to very poor airseal. The problem seems to stem from a couple of differences in how the Lonex hop up is constructed:

first, take a look at the difference in flange thickness between the two ("A" is Ares, "L" is Lonex)
[IMG][/IMG]

While that tiny little bit may not seem like much, it is enough to make it IMPOSSIBLE to install the Lonex hop up without altering the hop up spring length: I used the old trusty Dremel, and cut the spring down by about 3mm.

Second, the flanges are a bit to wide, and require filing to fit properly (quick fix). The metal alloy Lonex uses for the hop up is surprizing hard!

[IMG][/IMG]

Third, the Lonex body is noticably thicker than the Ares. Normally a good thing, this extra material actually seems to result in the magwell not seating properly:



This is how the magwell seats on the OEM Ares hop up...

[IMG][/IMG]

...and this is how it seats on the Lonex



Notice the difference in the gap between the top of the hop up and the magwell? While the Ares is almost spherical, the Lonex is decidedly oval. I am not certain, but I strongly suspect that because of the extra thickness of the Lonex hop up, the magwell is pushing "up" slightly on the hop up, and slightly springing the inner barrel. If that is the case, it would help explain why the Lonex hop is so hard to tune!

Fourth, once assembled you can see a very large difference in how a BB sits in between the nozzle and the hop up. If you look at the following photos, you can see that while the Ares holds a BB almost perfectly, the Lonex has enough space for a BB and a half! I figure that extra space is the main reason I get consistent double-feeding.

[IMG][/IMG]

[IMG][/IMG]

So, suffice it to say, I am re-installing the Ares hop up until such time as it breaks, or I find a 100% compatible replacement. I think with a little light machining, the Lonex could be made to fit and work well, I just don't have the time to fiddle with it. So, as far as I am concerned, the Lonex hop up unit is NOT compatible with an Ares G36.

[Kos-Mos]

Could have told you that before your ordered, but didn't catch it.

I ordred the opposite, a replacement ARES hop-up chamber to fit in a SRC G36 (TM compatible-ish). Other than the feed tube issue/fitting, it did not fit properly in the outbarrel section.

I have yet to break an ARES hop-up unit, so I am not sure why you would want to replace it.

I did break a CA, TM and SRC unit, and installed a Prowin, TM and "Matrix" as replacements.

[lurkingknight]

I tried fitting the lonex to my CA.. didn't fit.. despite being the same design, the measurements are different.

I filed a bit of the back off.. filed some of the prongs to make it sit back farther... it did not seal at all... 130 fps is about as much as I could get.

I gave up.. .client came to me with broken hopup on his ares, and the ares unit is out of stock currently, so I tried fitting my adjusted lonex into his ares... it seals reasonably well.. adjusted a bit more, but it's having issues feeding, I think more to do with mags being loose in the magwell.

So at this point we're at a bit of an impass, either start modifying his magwell or wait for the ares unit to come back into stock.

[Kratisto]

I haven't tested the Lonex hop up, but judging by your photos, it looks terrible. Prowin and 5kU hops works well without mods in some TM clones (ARES, CA), but it can be problematic in others (SRC, JG).

I think this is the solution for your woes, the Wii Tech Hop for the ARES/S&T G36 EBB and their clones:

http://www.wiitech.com.hk/eshop/prod...roducts_id=433

I haven't tried it myself, so caveat emptor

[lurkingknight]

I've not had any luck with prowin in a CA either... it gets temperamental sometimes it feeds, sometimes it doesn't.