007 SRC Guns
 

Does anyone know if the new SRC lineup at 007 are any good? I am interested in the full length M4 with RIS for $460. Are these guns better than a G&G or the new KWA's at Buyairsoft.ca or CapitalAirsoft?

http://www.007airsoft.com/gngvssrc.htm

May be a bit biased because he's the one selling them, but it's mostly not.

there is a comparison on the site between the two guns. why are you asking us?

Parts G&G M4 Advanced SRC M4 GEN III Win

Weight ~2400g unloaded ~2800g unloaded SRC


I'm new to the world of airsoft (and guns in general), but wouldn't you prefer a lighter gun? It must have a certain weight of course... but in general a lighter gun is better, isn't it? for a long day of mil-sim, more weight = more energy needed to carry. 400g may be a small amount, but 400g on the gun + 400 there + 800 here + 200 over there... that equals many kg overall! for a 10 walk this may not change much, but for many hours...

It's about realism. If lightness is your concern, then go and buy 100% plastic weapons. I have downgraded full metal guns to plastic for lightness in some games but a heavy loadout is part of the milsim experience. Heavier parts also usually show more durability and quality overall.

I think the $210 CQB M4 is a great value for an indoor weapon. I'm tempted to get one.

The rest are SRC Gen III with 400 FPS and fully upgraded internals out of the box and are outdoor weapons out of the box whereas with a G&G, you'd have to do some upgrades yourself, buy parts, pay a gun doctor. SRC is decent. I like their stuff. The SRC 416 is supposed to be one of the best 416s. SRC usually have some unique features. The SRC G36 for example has different parts than most other G36s like metal cocking handle, metal mag release, etc.

the shame alll those full metal lowers in asia wanting a nice canadian home : (


The g36 series peaked my interest tho those guns are plastic anyway

It seems SRC is slowly clawing its way up up the quality ladder.
Then again many airsoft companies have over the last couple of years. Although I'm not sure if their quality has gone up or peoples expectations have gone done. I would love to tear one apart for closer inspection and review.

Seems like SRC are pulling a CYMA.

Anyways, Ken, nice music choice.

I'm loving the support variant on the G36.

(Sorry, I dont know the exact model. Sue me.)

SRC has always been one of the better ones as a Taiwan company. If you want real airsoft companies climbing out of the gutter, try mainland china for JG and Cyma. TSD is SRC's cheap/lower end brand.

When SRC launched back in the early 90s they were a disaster. Over time they did show improvement. The SRC XM8 left me with a bad taste in my mouth. Like I said, I'm not willing to pass full judgment till I can actually take one of the new ones apart.

Does anyone know if they're TM compatible? Do they fit TM magazines?

Yup fits TM magazine without problem. I took an HK416 entirely apart as soon as got these new SRC's. and the gear boxes are tuned up very very well. Given the parts installed and output velocity, I have very good confidence in them.

TSD sells mainly SRC Gen 2 and Plastic products. I deal in SRC Gen 3 products.

Ken

so does the src have a better chance at handling a lipo than the kwa?

why don't you get av'ed and get one yourself? Honestly, dude there's not many people have experience with SRC, hell before G&G made their clear receiver, we know very little of them. KJW being sort of one as well. We don't know much. Most people in Canada stick to major companies like:

TM
CA
JG/Cyma/AGM
G&P
KSC/KWA


Some goto:
STAR/ARES
KA
VFC
ICS
Real Sword

I'm not exactly sure what you are attempting to ask.
The specs state that they are lipo ready.

http://www.007airsoft.com/gngvssrc.htm

So one would assume that it would be able to handle a lipo battery.

1+1 = 2

Were you maybe expecting 1+1 = donut?

I think what he was trying to say is "are SRC guns better internally than KWA guns?" And do they have less a chance to brake your gun when using a lipo.

g36 support varriant is called, wait for it, a mg36 lol. the are not very creative. airsoft wise its a g36 with a g&p front kit and cmag. some other little things too if your picky.

thanks full metal

KWA and SRC are about the same. Both have reinforced gearboxes and ball bearing spring guides and ball bearing bushings. Any gearbox with a >m100 spring and a metal spring guide is lipo ready in my books and the entire concept is a misnomer for marketing purposes.

SRC has better furniture and features.

this lipo ready fad is really starting to worry me. I got a p90 on lipo and it has a massive rate of fire, all we need is these kids with 1800rpm guns in close range. I have seen it happen bad enough on a 9.6volt.

I just REALLY hope they learn self restraint and trigger control.

+1

I understand when lipos are useful for space constraints, but i think no new player should ever start with a lipo.

Seriously, if you want high RoF, just play with a quality 9.6. It will put out more then enough.

yay airsoft beam weapons

You guys are getting your knickers in a knot for nothing.

ROFwhoring is a mentality. Lithium batteries make ROFwhoring easier, but they are merely a symptom of the problem.

Experienced ROFwhores running around with 10.8v NiCd packs scare me far more than any newbie with a lipo.

For one.. I'm not a fan of all these "400 FPS" out of the box guns that are being put into the hands of new players... it makes them rely on their gun to do the work for them instead of putting the effort in to develop themselves as a good player.

how does a gun do the work for us?

I believe what amos, and many of the older players are talking about, is how much faster, and harder todays guns shoot.


When many players started, basically the main choice of gun brand was TM with a big ol' NiCd battery.

Giving you about 280 FPS, and a RoF thats about half of what you will get on your lipo.

Because high FPS and high ROF is a brute-force method to getting BB's to the target. It doesn't encourage good playing practices.

We used to have a saying around here: "If you have to ask what you need to upgrade on your gun, you're not ready to upgrade." Now many of these guns come that way. You'll notice that a lot of vets guns actually shoot around the 360-370 mark, not upward of 400. There is a reason for this. A noob with a weaker gun will learn what it is. A n00b with a powerful one probably won't, because they won't be able to appreciate the differences in BB performance at lower and higher FPS.

I'm not a fan of n00bs having high FPS guns either. ROF whoring (which a lot of n00bs do -not all, but a lot) with a 400 FPS gun is NOT good.

oh i c

and just to add lighter fluid to the fire.

Gaurenteed none of these guys are running real caps or low caps, Its hicap 400fps 1800rpm hose at the guy until he calls hit because there are so many BB's around him he does not know if they are hitting him or its the trees falling on him because buddy with the chain saw on the other side of the field won't stop firing at him even long enough to hear him say hit so you just walk off and than get shot 8 more times in the back because your seen as a threat when your pointing the other direction with your kill rag out and gun above your head so they need to make sure your dead... people.


TM ak47, with 30 round realcaps, running stock, and I still stomp alot of G&G see how many pieces of white plastic we can put on the target hi cap warrior nubs.

I'm pretty puzzled by 007 perceived need to make CQB guns like the G36C and CQBR shoot 400fps. I'm suggesting it's Ken's choice due to the fact that I'm looking at SRC G36 Gen IIIs on US sites, and they are far from being all 400fps (even if they do include a spare M120 spring for you to DIYS).

Medium-to-long rifles are one thing, heck, I'll even play CQB with up to 370fps. But 400fps across the board long and short? That seems excessive and dangerous. Newbies are going to be caught between using overly hot guns and inexperienced DIYS (or payind someone else) downgrading right off the bat.

And frankly, even with a reinforced mechbox, I'd consider running 400fps on a version 2 a less than appealing idea. Especially with an aluminum piston head.

Unless Ken listed his fps wrong, of course.

I agree, My theory is that high numbers attract un-informed players. I'm not trying to bash Ken. He has done more for this sport then I ever will, and I think hes a great guy, but when it all comes down to it, hes still running a business, and the player who doesn't know any better, wants the gun with the highest numbers.


Maybe I'm wrong, but thats my theory.

I doubt Ken has listed it wrong.

He must have gone to a lot of trouble to make that SRC/G&G comparison chart, or at least enough trouble to verify the FPS.

However, I agree. I wouldn't want to be calling velocity checks all the time in CQB. Ken should be packaging the short guns with m100s and throw the m120s in the box.

but isnt 400 fps good for something like the m4 ris where it would be used for longer range? plus, you could use heavier bbs for when ur playing outdoors with a lot of brush. i understand wat u guys r saying tho about the cqb guns. 400 does seem quite excessive for cqb.

High FPS can be usefull in some situations, however, most veteren players seem to like their guns shooting about 370.

We don't really feel noobs should be playing with guns that hot.

Always remember, 400 FPS is a limit, not a goal

EDIT: I think the limit might be 450 in Calgary, not sure, but either way, my earlier point still stands.

JOC limit here in Calgary is 420 for AEG (full auto) and 500 for Single shot only(VSR,M24 those types.)

Thanks for clearing that up

No worries. Few of us went out last week and had a couple of guys from BC come down using M16's that were at 490. Had to look it up then to make sure lol.

I shoot my full auto AEGs at 400FPS. its the rule in this area.

I shoot my semi auto AEG at 440FPS, thats also the rule in this area.

Off topic: People who says "360~380 FPS is the sweet spot" is completely utter BS. And I will make this absolutely clear to everyone that there is NO such thing as a sweet spot. It won't increase your accuracy going to a lower FPS, this is just bullshit being fed from ill-informed tuners. Evidence proves there is no such thing, no matter what theory says otherwise.

I'm not encouraging noobs to shoot at 400FPS here, just calling out those poor mis-informed fellows. Please do keep using 360~380 FPS guns, it's easier on your mechbox.

Actually 380FPS with a 0.20g BB is the magical number. Using either a 0.28 or a 0.30 yields excellent results. Don't ask me to explain it, all I know is that it just is. While Sklad may say believe its bullshit, I don't think it is, however it doesnt matter what I say because I'm just an "ill informed tuner".

Hey there... I don't know where you get your information from, but there is such a thing as a "sweet spot"

Although they vary from gun to gun... it all has to do with the hop-up rubber... EVERY hop-up rubber has a point that it can apply an optimal back-spin force, if the BB is going to fast, it doesn't take full effect... if the BB is going to slow, it doesn't take full effect.

For most rubbers (guarder clear, Systema, TM) the sweet spot is within the 360-380 FPS range...

But what would I know.. I'm just an ill-informed tuner :rolleyes:

Edit:

I'm gonna add more to this;

A lot of people think that FPS is the be-all and end-all... This is not the case. With a properly tuned gun with tight airseal and a properly selected hop-up rubber, nub and unit and porting matching it's VERY possible to make a 200 FPS gun that will out preform a "greenly upgraded" 400 FPS gun. I've made a TM AK47 that fires at 230 FPS (I DOWNGRADED the spring) that will outrange most 400 FPS guns... I made this gun for the soul purpose of proving a point... And now the gun is THE BEST noob trainer gun around :P

that part is very true. I agree with you on that one. But for most rubbers, "sweet spot" is above and beyond 400.

Here's a clear evidence:
http://www.airsoftcanada.com/showthread.php?t=76317

That gun is shooting at 520FPS. Grouping at 300feet is around 1.5~2 feet circle, easily hitting man sized target shot after shot. I could even take shots beyond 300feet. This was the same with TM rubber and Nineball rubber, AND firefly rubber. They all yielded about the same results after properly tuning everything else in the gun as well as washing the hop up rubber.

this 360~380FPS myth thing, somehow started out by some other member here on ASC and just spread like wildfire.

You can go to another major forum such as Arnies/Airsoft Retreat/Airsoft Mechanics/Fillipino Airsoft/etc/etc and try to impose this myth, but be prepared to get shot down on sight, no other forums other than ASC will ever believe this myth being true, and these are countries with more players, more gun docs, and more experience. They won't believe you simply because it's not true, and there is no such thing. In theory, it works, and it's right, but ONLY in theory. In real world application, especially with airsoft guns that do only about 2Joules maximum, just does not happen.

I feel like im going through a huge tide here, since everyone else thinks Im just pulling this out of my ass. But try saying this "sweet spot" myth in another major forum, you will be caught in the exact same situation im in right now.


Now back to topic, veered off too much:
SRC and KWA are essentially the same. Internally they are both excellent. Just choose based on externals.

What's fps got to do with range? lol

Anyway, more importantly...
I beg to differ on the sweet spot above 400fps, I ran my VSR-10 at 400fps for the first season, just because of our close quarter field I didn't want to have to deal with minimum engagement ranges. When I upgraded to 470 I found the accuracy greatly decreased, and even at 440 it was sketchy. I put it back down to 400 and I was making 60 yard kills in heavy crosswinds and shooting people between blades of grass again.

Wasn't there another highly renowned sniper on this site that brought this EXACT argument up a few months ago? As I recall CDN_Stalker does the same

To answer your original question, Yes- the new SRC's are worth the price. Our team picked up 3 this week and have another lined up for next Tuesday. We've already gamed them in both and outdoor and CQB and are impressed with the durability, accuracy, ROF, and realistic weight. As mentioned in another post, the Matte finish on the reciever is a 1st for the Canadian market and doesn't need painting... You'll be extrememely pleased with your purchase.

I don't believe retailers should be policing the fps limits of the various local fields. There's a much larger population with their own skirmishs on private property that have their own various fps limits and I'm sure the 400fps out of the box appeals to that market by letting the buyer tune the AEG accordingly.... -VK

thanks vanilla. so the lower reciever is noticeabley different looking than, say, a g&g smoked reciever? would you say its darker or mainly just a different finish?

Hi All,

the 400fps rating is the factory raiting for the M120 spring set up. All SRC Gen 3 guns come with M120 spring, but as you know, the FPS is also dependent on air compression, seals, hop up setting, barrel bore, and most importantly, Barrel length.

So yes, the actual FPS of each SRC Gen 3 gun will vary. Here are a few that I have chronoed, although they have the same guts and system inside of the their gear boxes:

M4 Micro SD ~320fps
M4 CQB ~360 fps
M4A1 ~405 fps
MG36 ~415 fps

Ken
007Airsoft

Thanks, Ken. I really didnt know that those factors could make two guns with the same spring a motor shoot 95 fps different.

Mostly a case of barrel length, I would assume.

Too bad that MG36 is so hot. I guess I will be getting an m100 with if I decide to purchase it.

Thanks for the info, Ken.

I've own the Full alluminium SRC genIII hk416 (yes it really has a aluminium body :P) for about a year and a half now, and this gun is a beast!!

Really nice internals, the M120 feels more like a m110 on mine, (360 fps), and the piston has a 100% compression/airseal, wich means if you put your finger on the air nozzle, the motor wouldnt be able to pull the piston back.... :P

heres a review on Airsoft pacific with pictures of the internals on SRC's gen 3 gearbox.....

http://www.airsoftpacific.com/content.php?page=51

thanks palucol! so is this the same generation and internals as the ones selling at 007 minus the full metal body?

Yes it quite different than a smoke G&G receiver. It is darker and not glossy like the G&G so it blends in with the black on the gun.

ok thats great then. now i dont have to risk painting it. so has anyone else tried these guns? ive heard that the full metal ones are heavier than other brands of full metal? is this the same for the ones 007 sells?

I think the internal should be slightly better, since the one i have was a "preproduction version" but ya all gen 3 src should be top notch.... Minus the plastic cansoft lower.....

sorry but whats "interbal"?

Sry i meant internals....

I must say, I could hardly contain my excitement when I saw this up on 007airsoft! Great looking bunch of guns, that sound like top quality products.

Probably be seeing you soon Ken :P

Thanks man. Yes I was very excited for the arrival of this large SRC shipment as well. G&G was great from before, but now we finally have the real top of the line stuff to cater the need of those who are looking for "worry free" and "outdoor ready" airsoft guns.

I've gamed a couple of them myself, and am very very pleased.

Ken

if only lower receiver is metal, then it'll be a perfect stock gun. what are the chances of finding/importing the receiver?

On your own, not very high.
Through retailers on this website or through this websites buy and sell, substantially better.

Which ones have you gamed?

I've been looking forward to hearing about experience with these.

Maybe a KJW M4-style video review?

That one was very helpful.

Just to add on to that, the price of metal receivers are pretty steep when purchased seperately! Just keep that in mind if you are thinking "I'll get one of these clearsofts and then I'll just get a metal receiver later!"

compare to kjw GBBR which do you thing is better?

Completely different modes of operation, limits to what they can do, and appropriate uses (AEG vs GBB).

You can't compare a apple to an orange, or whatever other analogy you might want to make.

That's like asking which is better an AE86 or a Mustang. That being said you're probably better off with an AEG just because the price to enter is a lot cheaper ($50 GBBR mags? and if you get a WA, Ino, or G&P WOC the price of mags is something like $80 ea.) and there may be more support/knowledge for an AEG floating around just because it's been around longer.

However you should weigh each pro and con and pick what's right for you.

For a new player I would definitely have to say an AEG. It will be cheaper, less trouble and more versatile than a GBBR. Especially if this is your first gun and you haven't been around the airsoft scene for a while, go with the AEG. Once you're a little more committed to the sport and are positive you want to go with a GBBR, then get one.

the answer is it depends :cool:

I tried the M933, also the HK416 (the one I was most looking forward to seeing).

Comparing the SRC M4 Gen 3 to KJ GBBR, I'd say AEG is always more reliable while GBB's are hell of alot more fun to shoot. So the answer is it depends. When I need a gun that I can absolutely depend on, I go for AEG's... still.

Ken

AEG first, than a GBB... you don't buy a race car with out having a daily driver.

Hey Ken

I was wondering what your take was on the GRC M4 SD, why exactly is that weapon dishing out less fps then the rest of the line, like you said barrel size does play a factor but with the surrpressor on the gun is that incased around the barrel or a cosmetic external?

I'm looking at the M4 SD as my next gun already in the sport of Airsoft after purchasing from you, the G&G Mp5 A4 which by the way exceeds my expectations! I appreciate all the support with the purchase btw.



Thanks again =)

Hey,

Anyone (guess Ken would know haha), if there will/is an AK47 line in by this company that would eventually come to canada?

Really been trying to avoid an m4 like the plague, but it's looking pretty attractive right now. Just don't want to buy an M4 and see an AK come out months later :(

And do all the adjustable stock versions hold the battery in that bulky battery "fake laser" thing that goes on the rail? Or can the m4 SD hold it in the stock, while only the HK416 uses that laser holder? What about the M16 (noticed it says Mini battery, guess it must go in the stock, but the other M4's I'm not sure about)

I dont think SRC makes an AK, transparent or not.
If you want an AK get AV'd.

The M4 holds the battery in the but of the retractable crane stock.

Cool thanks.

As for the M16, I'm new, but it says it uses a mini battery.

Can mini batteries still come in 9.6V etc.? I guess the only difference is that they dont last as long?

I'm in the process of getting verified (already spoke to someone, just have to wait), but these seem pretty cool. Never having to upgrade and all that

src has a gen 3 full metal ak line.

Yes, SRC has a very very nice AK line, GEN III as well. This WILL BE their next Cansoft project, and I am hoping I will be receiving some samples after the new years :)

M4 SD has a commando length inner barrel (300mm or so) which is shorter than a regular M4 barel (370mm or so). Hence the lower fps.



Ken

Don't buy anything until your AV goes through except gear. I'm serious, the amount of cool/pre-upgraded guns is a real eye opener. Sometimes around tuition time or random I-need-cash-now moments you get some really good deals. For $400-$500 you can get some really nice full black guns, sometimes with a bunch of mags, batts. etc. Wait until you see the classifieds, then decide if you want an SRC.

I think..... I may smell some Knyte/Amos reviews coming up in the future......

this man speaks the truth

YouTube- 007 Airsoft - SRC Gen III M4 Gearbox Review

Shimming was done properly, in fact, exactly how I would have done them. Without the cylinder and spring assembly, the gears can spin freely even with a tightly closed gear box. There is only very minor play for the each gear axle between the corresponding bearings.

Back side of cylinder head is lined with a rubber pad to absorb impact from piston head :)

Ken

how are the externals on the gun in comparison to say G&G or KWA?

This question was literally just answered. Read more threads b4 posting. Thx.

Spoonfeeds:
http://www.airsoftcanada.com/showthr...51#post1110851

Duplicate accounts are a no no.

http://i273.photobucket.com/albums/j...lIPcompare.jpg

MW2 perma banned, and I extended connor.eckert's ban to a full year since this is the third dupe/troll account he's created.

Four troll accounts, you think the pitiful speck would get a life or something.

He deserves the ban extension.

Staff fist bump!

Boo yeah!

THIS.

I don't see why 400fps is good.

In fact, KEN mentions that the 400fps on the SRC models is better than the ~360fps on G&G ones. Imo, that's wrong
I play CQB for the most and, 350fps is the limit. with a ~360fps gun I can play both indoors and outdoors.

keep in mind that it doesnt come with batteries

So?

No high end guns do.

You wouldn't want the batteries that some air soft manufacturers produce anyways.

I think this is a very good thing.
That way I don't have something taking up more space in the garbage can.

true but i've seen some that come with decent ones

Don't say G&G, because their included batteries and chargers are SHIT.

What guns come with decent ones?

+1 , every included battery are sht ;) that's why their free to make you seem their like a worth package!! You will end up buying a package with useless junk (goggles , cheap mag , cheap battery , cheap chargeR) and you'll end up changing them...

This is a complete review of the TSD/SRC G36 Gen II http://www.airsoftretreat.com/review...ate=1178931043 , you can see the difference visually right away. You get for what you paid for i guess.

Not true, the ones that come with the ICS ones are great, they just don't last long.

Uh have you even tried one? the one i kept from the g&g i had is fantastic lasts me an entire day of play(8-10hours) and possibly more. unless i just got lucky and got a good one

Dude, just wait, mine crapped out on me after about 5 weeks. Its shit, got really hot and the fuse broke too!

I have two G&G batteries and work great..use them all the time

I'm positive he's tried one. The guy has extensive AEG/GBB work under his belt. I'd definitely pay attention to what he says, he's not trying to argue.

neither am i but from what ive seen with mine(used from spring to end of summer) its great. maybe not for a super ugraded gun or anything shooting near 400fps spitting out 30bb/s or anything.

@scurvythepirate: ouch that sucks

and like i said maybe i just got lucky with mine :P

Nope, the batteries are made up of poor cells. Sure it'll power your gun, but I highly question the reliability of these batteries... So far out of the probobly 20 "MY GUN BROKE -- NO WAIT ITS JUST MY BATTERY" incidents, I'd say 75% of them were using G&G batteries, now... a large portion of that would be related to the shitty chargers that they come with, but there certainly is some people who's problems stem from the batteries themselves.

It actually will SAVE you money by buying a high quality battery and charger. Spend $100 on a charger and $30 or so on an Intellect of an Elite cell'd battery that can withstand the draw and re-charging over and over... and you wont have to replace your $20 battery every couple of months.

Hell... if I could make up my mind on an AEG for more than a couple months, I'd be willing to bet I'd still be using the same battery that I would have initially purchased :)