BB Bastard "Sniper Grade" 0.36g and 0.40g review
 

New BBs, new thread start. Link to my previous review of products is here for reference:

http://www.airsoftcanada.com/showthr...hlight=bastard

This time, will still use my TM Mk23 springer and CA M24 sniper rifle for the testing (Both for chrony, M24 for group consistancy and field use).

Ok, so I got one bag of each and started phase one earlier tonight. Am impressed so far. First one I had Bastard 0.30g BBs still in my mag, cleaned the barrel with a dry patch, came out clean. Each string of 25 shots, five per target, barrel was cleaned before and each time the patch came out clean. First run was a set in test sample of, left right, down, left right, 30ft in basement, 0.30g, 0.36g, 0.40g 0.30g, 0.30g rounds:

http://photos-e.ak.fbcdn.net/photos-...36_7473230.jpg

Next was 25 shots of 0.36g Bastards:

http://photos-a.ak.fbcdn.net/photos-...40_2524880.jpg

And 25 shots of 0.40g:

http://photos-g.ak.fbcdn.net/photos-...46_3295022.jpg

Now if anyone who has shot an airsoft gun for groupings knows, 2" at 30ft using the best and most consistant gun/ammo is fucking good. What I grabbed here at best was 1", a couple groupings were just a single jagged hole. Did get a couple flyers, but if the single one was ignored, then I'd have smaller than an inch grouping which is fucking amazing for an airsoft gun.

More will come, chrony testing the next couple nights, stay tuned.

nice man. ive been waiting with bated breath for this review. Im hoping scarecrow will make they in white, so i can used them with my Tanaka Kar98k (i will use it as an infantry and a sniper's rifle).

The colouring isn't that bad at all, my using them in the field (Phase Three) over a few months will determine if they are usable as is for tracking, or can't see at all. This review is gonna be a work in progress over the next half dozen months, so will post opinions as things go.

you should pry open some of them and check for air bubbles

Had a conversation with Scarecrow on the field Saturday about this, their are no airbubbles in the heavier weights, u need alot of force to break one open, and altho bb's essentinally need the airbubble for a smooth break upon impact, these bb's dont powerderize or go into 10 peices, they stay in pretty large chunks.

Mike to add a bit to the review, Jay gave me some .40 to try out in my 600mm tightbore equiped SPR, and I must say impressive, adds a bit of range on full hop, and much better constant accuracy.. Now this isnt done with targets, just outdoors full range shooting, but I can tell the improvment just from watching. So these arent just for sniping, if u have a precision AR, they will work great for you as well.

This is good to know. I'm already picking up a few bags when my cash flow starts up again but might have to grab a few more seeing I wanna turn the EBR into a real nail driver for the summer.

I'll have some tonight to test.
I won't be able to do a controled test. But it will be a comparaison of feel between strait 0.36g and BB bastart 0.30g.

I will be shooting in an indoor field, so I'll have both long range and no wind.

I'll do as I did with the other review, split a few and take a pic.

Thanks for your effort. I know a bunch of people appreciate the data.

I love the .30 BB bastard bb's for my VSR and will be ordering some heavier ones today to test with.

Guess you can say I work for BBs. Lol

or you're just a Bastard bastard! :D

Ya, maybe, or you could just say that I'm a cheap bastard that loves free ammo! Lol

That works too!

I'd love to be a bastard like that too.

regarding the COLOUR of the Heavy Bastards
 

This weekend of the FR game hosted by Zeon, I spent the lunch time lull tuning down my APS2EX so that it cronied at 413 fps with 0.25 weight BBS....then scrimmed the rest of the day with it.
I was not impressed with the high cross winds (throwing the 0.25 weight BBs over 6 feet off centre at 100 feet). But needless to say, at the end of the day I took the opertunity to run some of the 0.36 weigh BB Bastards, and check out the "stealth" aspect of the non white BBs.

I found that the colour of the 0.36s are (in my opnion) excellent for tracking the BBs from the shooters prespective, but do give other observers a problem tracking the BBs (unless there is some type of drastic visual difference between the BB and the back drop). The subtle colours are easily distinguishable from the the natural surroundings, but not nearly a visible as the blazing white BBs.

Now I am use to using the graphite coated 0.36s which a lot of shooters have tracking issues with, but the BB Bastard pastel mint green 0.36s provided no problems with tracking every one of the 25 shots I plinked around with into different back drops. A couple were fired toward the tree line, a couple into the sand berms, and a couple into the areas with structures. Each shot was easily tracked from when it entered my field of vision, right through to the target.

And of course the heavier weight BBs made a huge difference in the effect that the cross wind had on my shots. The varience at 100 feet compaired to when I was running the 0.25s earlier in the day went from ther 6 feet off centre, to about 2 feet of center (an easily "guestimated" adjustment reguardless of what ever type of optics you are using).

I did not have a chance to recrony using the 0.36s for an fps comparison, but the over all effective range was greater with the 0.36s compaired to the 0.25s (because the shots were more consistant). Yes, the 0.25s went a further distance, but as I said, the 0.36s had a greater effective range, where you'd get more hits with fewer shots compaired to when using the 0.25s (basic airsoft ballistics).

Anyways, the colours of the 0.36s and 0.40s that the BB Bastard is offering us will continue to make it easy to tell when you've got what in your mags, and offer a great "stealth" colour that is not so dark that even the shooter cannot track it at long range.

Another great product from the Bastard.

SHA DO

Like I said guys, if you want this product I will carry it, but its contingent on you guys liking the product and wanting me to carry it. If the verdict is it does what you want it to do, I'll carry it - this batch was a one-off, but I'll get more done and at a better price as well.

So far so good for me, too bad I have to wait til at least the end of the month to get some 'distance' time, either at my babe's farm or the first LZ game on the 4th.

Was firing off some groups the other night and still am impressed with both weights, even shot a group of five 0.20g BBs (wasn't aware the size of the hole those things from my M24 make!), even thought I'd shoot five at each target, then realized I dont' have any 0.28g! Grrr, TESTIE!!!!!!

Still have to grab some chrony results, know I'll get the usual 100fps difference between the 0.20g and the 0.36g, but am interested in the 0.40g velocity. And see the consistancies as per norm.

OK, here are some inital results from chronying with my TM MK23 springer, and I'm weirded out by shots #7 and #8 using the 0.36g. Second verification set will bring out any flaws in gun or BB (my springer is the most consistant gun I own, is why I use it to find the best data for BB chrony strings). All rounds shot are Bastards BTW.

0.20g

216.7
218.7
221.3
217.1
216.7
221.5
217.0
215.1
220.9
215.4

0.36g

153.1
159.6
159.1
155.8
154.6
156.5
157.3
175.0?
149.8?
154.7

0.40g

147.0
147.4
142.8
143.3
145.5
143.0
144.7
146.9
145.9
145.7

Is odd that I don't see the 100fps drop that I'm used to between 0.20g BB and the Straight 0.36g BBs (only ones previously available in that weight), so this means that the Bastard 0.36g are bigger and much more consistant, even the 0.40g don't show the 100fps drop. Both are more impressive to me now!

Anyone compared to Madbull's equivalent?
Some friend of mind pointed out the similitudes of these two brand of BBs.

I got some BB bastard heavy weight and I'll be comparing them with Madbull equivalent when I get my hands on them soon.

nice compilation so far stalker. keep em coming. though i too and really puzzled to those last 2 shots with .36g. that is just weird.

Is why I'm going to run a second round of tests to see if it's my gun or the BBs. But will also be doing it with my M24, so two runs each with spring guns..........should weed out where the problem might lie. Still, the 0.36g results are better than I've seen with 0.36g Straights............

Good day or should I say good evening to you...I truly appreciate the time you took to review these two caliber's of bbs. I recently aquired a DSR-1 sniper rifle and was wondering what a heavier gauge of ammo would result in...now I know..40 seems to be the way to go!..THANKS!

My experience with madbull bb's the first and only time was horrible... they misfed, no velocity, dual fed, ect in both my guns, both tightbores, as well as several others at the game, worked fine with standard barrels, but did not work at all in tightbores... Always stick with Bastards from now on.

In the .36gr and .40gr the colors are the same because of the materials used. Once you start getting past .30 you're limited in your choices of substrate material, but there are differences in manufacturing, finishing etc. I've spoken with my supplier and they assured me that they are not the manufacturer for Madbull. I admit I was taken aback when I saw the Madbull product at TAC09, but on closer inspection there are differences, so I am pretty sure I am not being fed a line.

I plan to run another batch of tests AFTER I give the BBs a good wash to get the oil off them, and possibly the colouration is smearing is an issue with them. I prefer my sniper ammo to be dry, completely.

That's conforting... I had the feeling I was ripped off.
I had a hard time beleiving you would put your name on the line to pass us rebranded BBs.

Damn it Fox, I totaly forgot to give you some of my 0.40 madbull bbs. Next time.

well isn't that because the straights are grossly inconsistant? i thought i remember you saying that they were incredibly inconcsistant in terms of diameter and such. as for the bb inconsistancy, perhaps it was a fluke, whereby those two particular bbs actually weight less than .36g.

Ya, some guy in the US measured the Straights and from one to another of the random BBs in the same bag found 5.88-5.94mm at times. And the inner bubbles were often off center too, makes them fly worse.

Ok, did another couple strings, and check this first one out, have a very small stash of 0.36g BBs left, best way to compare weight vs. weight of the only two 0.36g BBs available. TM MK23 springer same as before, 0.36g Bastards vs. 0.36g Straight BBs.

0.36g Bastards

153.1
159.6
159.1
155.8
154.6
156.5
157.3
175.0?
149.8?
154.7


0.36g Straights (graphite washed off)

132.0
146.2
136.7
152.6
136.3
152.8
133.6
133.7
136.1
140.5

Bastards for the win!

And, next up, ran a string of 0.20g through my M24 (nice to see, hadn't done much testing since I swapped out and tuned it last year)

500.0
498.0
498.6
499.0
499.7
495.5
498.8
500.7
502.0
500.9

Will add all results together once I'm done, that way one can look at the readings in one thread instead of numerous ones.

I'd like to switch to the .40's for everyday use in all my AEG's and GBB's - seems like a solid thing to do, especially if I'm going to see a range increase at full hop!

And thats exactly the thought I had when I saw them too, people are gonna think I'm rooking them - but most people who know me should know better. I maintained from the start this is a test batch and only will be reordered if YOU guys ask me to do it. Frankly higher weight BBs have a lower profit margin and you can't move the volume - its really a service thing for me - I want to be able to sell you all your BB needs in one order - so if I have to stock it to give you complete service, I will - PROVIDED the product is good. The jury is still out on that at the moment although the .36g look promising.

Ok, ran more tests through my M24, still interesting. Bold are high and low of each string.

0.36g Bastards

406.4
407.8
397.8
400.1
408.9
406.9
406.8
403.0
408.0
392.3

0.36g Straights

401.4
369.2
369.4
370.7
403.8
398.6
360.8
399.6
404.3
402.2

Just for clarity, I didn't clean my barrel at all, ran the 0.20g BB Bastards through it again.

0.20g Bastards

501.6
497.1
502.3
500.9
498.7
502.0
503.1
499.2
498.6
509.3

0.40g Bastards

381.8
379.9
377.2
382.8
383.9
379.0
381.4
382.3
379.8
381.8

Ok, the more data I see the better the .36's look.

Order incoming, better get some to test before they are gone.

Am just about done doing some more target shooting (hadn't done with the 0.36g Straights before, surprisingly they behaved well for a group), so 0.36g Straights, 0.36g Bastards, 0.40g Bastards, figured I'd let loose my very small stash of 0.43g Straights................... and maybe follow up with some 0.30g Bastards. Also have been swabbing the barrel with a dry patch each time, plan to take a pic of them, but one thing to consider is I had cleaned my barrel before with a patch, dry, and this was after a good 50-100 shots, it came out dirty, I should have clenaed it more and made the patch come out clean first, then tested. Oh well, guess I should do that again, woh is me, more shooting! ;)

My thread, new post. :D

http://photos-f.ak.fbcdn.net/photos-...13_7030496.jpg

http://photos-c.ak.fbcdn.net/photos-...018_999638.jpg

NOTE: 30ft distance, bench rested CA M24, Straight BBs have the graphite washed off, Bastards are fresh out of the bag.

Ok, had a chance to send a few 0.36g and 0.40g BBs downrange last weekend (as well as a couple dozen .308 rounds) and while I didn't get too many 0.40g BBs off, I found the 0.36g BBs, with full hop up on my M24 (have it set up for around 430fps w/.20g in fairness of others that have to abide by the 450fps max rule......... me included now), at an aimed dead on distance (set at 30ft, has served me well in the past up to 0.30g BBs), the 0.36g Bastards would hit about a foot to a foot and a half low at a measured 138ft. But at least they were relatively consistantly hitting low like that. So this weekend I'll have to spend my time as CO of the Green team, on the radio barking orders and dialing in my M24 for 200ft if I can, likely have to settle for 150ft and shoot with sme elevation offset like normal shooters have to deal with.

Anyways, 0.36g is pretty heavy right now, have to game it and 0.30g, add to the review, the try out the 0.40g, but likely they will be not very useful in the <450fps setting, but stand by. I'd still love to see a 0.33g or 0.34g BB out there as consistant as the Bastards. So my 0.40g might end up being Glock 19 ammo for the year.

Got to use some of these at the game on Saturday, really bad conditions, cold, wet, winds gusting 60km/h................ even with full hop up on with my M24, I'd get each of the BB weights dropping hard around 140ft, and I mean literally dropping hard! No amount of elevation from my rifle would get them to go farther.

Am questioning these weights in a rifle shooting under 450fps, wish I had access to other sniper rifles to test these out on. I did swap out the hop up rubber, a KN65 with a hard bucking behind it and put a Guarder clear in there, have to see what it shoots like then. Looks like I also got an airleak, shooting around 400fps now, which is perfect for the game next weekend, 350fps max for AEGs and 400max for sniper rifles. Will be using the 0.30g Bastards there.

Nutshell, am really seeing more of a need for something like a .33g BB, as opposed to heavier. I DO find these to be very consistant though. I'm going to wash the oil off all the BBs and see if I can get a bit more friction from the hop up rubber, this might be the key thing. Will report back in a few weeks after I get a chance to get my rifle back up to ~450fps and get some outdoor shooting done.

hey stalker, are you using the PDI hop up unit?

Ya, I am, and just put a stiffer and thicker O-ring on there to tension the levers down more. Still have three original brass ones here. Haven't really noticed a difference among them all.

if you can use AEG rubber and buckings, try using the Prometheus Hard Red ones.

Their bucking is really responsive and consistant, it should be able to over hop atleast 0.36g

hope that helps

I don't think it's the hopup that's the problem, it's the sheer weight at the FPS he's running.

Agreed. When I shoot .43g BBs out of a 450fps rifle, no amount of hopup will make them fly like a .30g.

The BB just arc nicely. They are easy to place precisely at short distance though.

I washed my .30g and 0.36g in warm soap and water last night, will give me a bit more range, but still, I think 0.36g is too high.

Harder hop up rubber will give more spin =\

so atm, i should use my .30g weight in my Kar98k. thanks for the info.

Higher friction will give more spin. Harder rubber is likely to disrupt the BB path a bit too much. I'd rather have more of a high friction kiss than a whack on the BB's head. I've used 0.36g relatively fine over the years, but my rifle was shooting around 500fps. Asking a rifle shooting 430fps to lob a heavy BB past 150ft is a challenge. I shot at a guy about 160ft away and aimed at him, literally, his head in the bottom of my scope, I still fell short.

I'm talking about the little cylindrical rubber that pushes down on the bucking. The harder that is, the more hop up(Friction will be the same with the hop up rubber, but there will be more spin). Prom Hard is the hardest one I've ever had.

I actually removed the one I had in behind my RH65 rubber, it was actually a translucent white solid chunk of something, way harder than any known hop up bucking. Maybe I can try it with my Guarder clear. I used to use the clear back in the day and loved it, even with 0.36g, but I was shooting higher than 450fps anyways then.

Oh, just to reiterate since BB weight and velocity has come up, last year I was getting close to 300ft distance (about a 20ft group though) using 0.30g Bastards and having my M24 set up for around 340fps, was all in the way the hop up was tweaked. So any velocity under 450fps should be using less than 0.36g and more than 0.28g (found the 0.30g net me more distance and consistant flight than the 0.28g). 0.36g and the 0.40g should be used over 450fps, which I see as a small market due to most fields going with 450fps as a maximum, yet some fields will allow trusted and skilled snipers to run 500fps rifles knowing they never had a problem with engagment distances (minimum 100ft for me, even at times I've NOT taken the shot at that distance unless I could guaranteee a webbing hit).

so on a hot day, i should be running .36g + in my Tanaka Kar98k as i have heard it max out at around 465fps + depending on the ambient temperature.

You should be fine. You ARE running a gas rifle afterall. If I can get a 0.36g or 0.43g BB out to ~130ft with my slightly upgraded Glock 19............. mind you that's aiming for the head or slightly above the head and hitting the chest.

Well, guess what? I washed my 0.30g and my 0.36g BBs (warm water, dishsoap, rinsed and left to dry), installed a Guarder Clear rubber in my M24, found my fps to sit right around 400fps (which was perfect due to a game I had on Saturday, largely close quarters stuff, sniper rifle limit was 400fps w/0.20g), and found with full hop up prior to game, I could easily get my 0.36g out to 200ft and even able to plop many of them into a ~18" hole into the big white barrel things I was shooting at. So nutshell, we're talking a 0.36g BB travelling around 300fps and giving me really good range and consistancy, even in mild gusting winds.

I'lll have to post this up in a separate thread just to bring it to other's attention, high fps doesn't necessarily mean extra range. Am going to likely keep my M24 set up this way because I loved the way it shoot last game (was a tack driver!) Best part about having it set to 400fps is I can shoot guys at closer ranges, like 60ft, as long as I can plant the round on webbing or a pouch, which is easy. Oh ya, I have my scope set high, so point of impact is around 120-130ft, but inside of that the rounds hit high. Remember shooting a guy the other night about 100ft away, I aimed for his vest around the left nipple (he was partially facing away) and my BB hit him in the upper arm, I saw his fleece get tugged up there.

So overall before and during this game, I must have shot an easy 150 rounds (am sure quite a few guys didn't call the hit, no way I was missing at 100-140ft), and even with a dirty tightbore, I was still able to clear my last shot in the staging area on the range, 2ft x 2ft steel plate about 180ft away (in the dark with a non-illuminated scope) same as I had done pre-game.