Homemade Grenade rules across Canada
 

In the Ottawa region and as far as Montreal.. several players make their own grenades for use on the field. There are various ways but most involve a paper/cardboard shell, some sort of bastardized pyrotechnic and bb's/dried peas etc. From my experience, the whole thing is pretty unregulated and I'm curious to see what rules everyone else has.

For our area, the only real rules are that you must call out "Grenade!" before you throw one. If it lands withing 5 feet, you're supposed to call yourself out (which rarely happens)

I personally don't agree with calling it out before you throw one. Most grenades are no louder than a firecracker and cannot damage hearing. Yelling grenade before throwing one, is the same as yelling from across the field that you're going to shoot at someone before you do. I like to use mine as a surprise tactic/flashbang, throw it in the room and charge in shooting after it goes off.

How do you guys feel about it?

Nice idea, what if the grenade lands behind you, and while you're running you can't see it if it comes 5ft or not? lol

Home made pyro is banned at many places in Canada due to safety issues, liability issues, and legality issues (its illegal to modify fireworks without the proper licenses.)

I have never really followed the 5 foot rule, I call myself out if the peas/BB's actually hit me. Sometimes you can be 20-40' away and still get hit if its all clear, sometimes you can be standing beside it and you aren't. Real grenades have a far larger kill radius than 5 feet.

I call out when I throw grenades because I am told to. The only time I would say its required is when playing indoors. The bang inside of a small room with only one door is enough to phase your hearing for a couple minutes, its happened to me. Also I have seen some florescent lights shattered when a grenade went off and the room had 10' ceilings.

Outdoor games I don't really see calling it as being required and late this past season a lot of people stopped calling grenades (Warmongres, ODA, GBA, and other teams) because it was seen as unnecessary. Just make sure everyone knows they are in play.

or we can just all support AI and buy their grenade and then we dont have to call out etc etc. Though i fully agree that homemade nades are awesome what with the bang and the fact that they are actually effective.

Useless out doors, and not environmentally friendly either. And expensive!

Dry peas rock!

While you may not agree with calling out "Grenade"... When someone does call out grenade... you're a lot less likely to pick up that sparkling thing which landed next to you. Not to mention, from a purely team oriented aspect, it lets your own team to get to cover before they get hit by bits of bbs.

At BW2 there was pyro, and call me a pussy, but it scared me. I go to airsoft games to get shot by BBs and potentially injure myself by running and diving for cover... Explosives are not something I take lightly, as they are home made, and the only person I trust around explosives is myself.

Having the urge to pick up that round thing with a burning fuse is Darwinism at it's finest.

I understand the tactic of calling grenade to inform your teammates that you're tossing one, but Im talking about telling the enemy that you're going to throw one at them. This gives them time to run away/find better cover/escape.

I'm quite sure that real military doctrine calls for calling out "grenade" when one is thrown. It normally preceeds an assualt, so even when the shrapnel may not actually kill the enemy, the concussion can disorient them, and it will at least get their heads down while you advace. Calling it out protects you from having a friendly fire casualty, AND has the effect of causing your enemy to put his head down while you advance.

It all depends whether or not you actually expect your grenade to kill anyone, or just screw them up/ send them running so you can shoot their asses.

I'll stick with m203's. might not be able to toss one into an open window or doorway but still loads of fun even though it's a highly inefficient use or BB's sometimes.

Grab a hand full of used bbs, and throw them at the enemy., FIRE AWAY!

Home made pyro is pretty much banned in Alberta, and some fields won't allow it at all, home made, professionally made, whatever

I've used homemade grenades on myself and close friends at private scrims. Both indoors an out. I feel they are safe when tossed underhand, and Verbal warning is giving by the 'Nader to the 'Nadee indoors. and a "thrown near, not thrown at" common sense mentality is the status quo.

I find its more difficult at times for the thrower to light the fuse (especially outdoors) and get it out quick before the target figures out whats going on.
Many times I have friendly fired myself with my own nade, both pyro and AI. I have also thrown back a pyro to have it air burst above the thrower.

If most people are smart about it and use only as much pyro as needed to give the projectiles an adequate spread radius, you'll be ok, but when hosting games where this is allowed its really up to:
1) The Host
2) The General Consensus decided by the players.

Most of the issue as to why its not allowed to be used is that the noise attracts attention...negative attention

Im all for this type of thing, I like the element of danger to throw us all off guard. Its real great to have going on at a Milsim, and anyone who was assaulting the militia home base at BW2 will know that as the smoke was pluming upwards in the sky, and after Krusty lit off 3 of his whiz-bangs. It was myself and a sniper friend running the roman candles and bottle rocket batteries like madmen on an artillery barrage.

I am however, Respectful of the safety of others and would never do anything to put someone's health in danger. If someone isn't of mutual opinion then its always better to leave that out.
Better safe than sorry.

Could someone please pm me with directions for making some of these.
I'm not using them for an actual game unless so permitted by a host, however it's just something I would like to look at for photo ops or video's.
In a controlled environment.
I just wish I could get those ones made by zero delay still.

Bad assumption. ;)

But I understand your point, as long as pyro is announced before game day and cleared with game admin, I'm ok with it.

I remember that it was in good fun and completely safe and controlled.

Oh don't get me wrong, BW2 was awesome, I just didn't know there was pyro... and it's not like I had pyro grenades going off near me: I was just comparing my experience with pyro to the thought of pyro grenades in a game. I didn't mean to say that BW2 was unsafe: It's really, really safe. :)

NO pyrotechnic in KELOWNA. It will burn again.:( trying out some gas Powerd nades on the feild. The AI nade just did not do it for me so im trying out some others. But at this time there are no rules on nades here in k-town do to the fact no one uses them. In three year's I only seen three nades used.

I think are first rule is.

Not to be throwing nades at anyone's head.

The second rule.

If your in ten feet of the nade when it go's off your dead and call your hit.

Ill think of more later.

Ya, the grass in kelowna is practically dry before the snow melts.

I believe modifying fireworks (Unless you won a pyrotechnician's license) is an illegal offense in Canada.

I don't like home made-pyro, I've had bad experiences with them before in the past (people using them in indoor games and hucking and airbomb charge in a small plastic ball into a small room. Sometimes when it's really quiet my ears will start ringing... and that's a definite sign of hearing loss.

We have been using homemade nade at our indoor game for the last 2 games, no issue whatsoever, but we are relying on people judgement (ie, stay with small pyro, like respecting the 350 fps limit). And we do call them before hand. What I realize for having throw over 40 nades in 2 games is that 1) I suck at throwing so far (throwing under fire is not easy lol) 2) it is mostly useful for getting people to move out of position and then get shot by your buddie covering you while you thrown. I use the following receipe:

Paper cup (like at the dentist)
2 small firecracker (can t recall the name, red in color, 20$ for 100 down here)
0.12 BB
Bit of cheap masking tape

2 small firecracker improve bang happening, like having 2 engines on an aircraft, one could go down, but the other will bang
0.12 is light enuff for good spread, heavier pellet reduce blast radius from what I have seen

Video here, around minute 08:30

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ftzR...ad.php?t=76293

That only works for Stalker, and at any distance including across the country. At elast according to some lame fuckwit that wrote it as legend, I'm still waiting for someone to call hit after tossing handfuls of BBs at them.

Small charges like that I would have no problems with... I've seen people using airbomb charges..

The entire building shook when those things went off.

Try using dried peas, they're lighter than .12 and they'll give you a much better radius.

Entire building shook? You must have been at TTAC3 where the walls set up almost fall over if you look at them. A few rooms away when an airbomb charge goes off, you can hear the bang, but not even an air movement from them. Not that I recommend them being used indoors though, they are nasty and unless one has the knowledge on how to deal with something like that in a closed in environment to prevent ear damage, I don't recommend their use at all (even though I helped design what is now known as the "Warmonger grenades"), purely outdoors by my preference. If one goes off under your ass, you are a deaf, dumb and blind MOFO and deserve it, more so if you accept getting shot by 400fps guns but whine about getting an ass sprayed by dry peas and 60-100fps.

Ugh that was painful in that room in Melville. Don't remind me of that.

I love a good solid boom!

Airbomb grenade are too loud.. you must call them or someone will get hurt.

But grenades made with firecrackers are innofensive.. I don't understand why we still call them. I trust people making and throwing them.

One day we will throw a grenade at the ennemy and we will have the perfect suprise!

P.S. Actually I should not trust Long Bong after that grenade he totally trown at me while I was on his team.

Pacheko: did you have any problems with the ones Dutchy and I were throwing on Saturday?

Mmmmm are you talking about the little rockets?

I really like the one Silverthorn and Long Bong are using.. small, effective and small "boom" just enough to make someone go crazy "so we can finally clear that frikin' room".

And cheap to make :)

If you EVER throw one at or near me...
EVEN if you call out "Grenade!" before doing so...

Im still going to beat the shit out of you if it hits me.

I would personally rather have a grenade I use blow beside me then having a 350 fps AEG burst me in the face from 15 ft. And I did try both :)

Nope. This was in Melville Saskatchewan, where the walls are set up solid concrete of an old abandoned hospital.

I bought some peltors soundtraps to protect myself against airbombs grenades being used inside.

I got nothing against them if they are used correcly and they are called before. Screw the "suprise"! Grenades are no suprises, they are to make people go out of hiding or coward in a corner, hands on their hears, so you can come in and shoot them.

Airbombs can injure people if badly used, one of my teamate got his hear drum blowed in an outside game. If the grenade would have been called, he would probably had time to cover his hears. Also, the grenate was trown ON him, while he was prone in tall grass... that's a no no, even with firecraker.

IMO, there's way too much of a risk of permanent hearing damage to be using home-made pyro. Indoors we've got the Tornado.. outdoors I don't think I've ever run into a situation where I NEEDED a grenade... Sure they would have been useful, but some good suppressing fire and good teamwork can clear even the most defended bunkers (+ it looks so much more epic than tossing a little grenade in)

well according to wikipedia people do call out that a grenade has been thown.

"A call is usually given upon deploying a grenade, to warn friendly forces. Some yells, such as "grenade" or "fire in the hole" are used when a grenade has been thrown in by an enemy; in any instance the purpose is to warn fellow soldiers to take cover.

In the U.S. Military, when a grenade is dropped into an enclosed space like a tunnel, room, or trench, the person dropping the grenade should yell "fire in the hole" to warn that an explosion is about to occur. Other U.S. military procedures include calling "frag out" to indicate that a fragmentation grenade has been deployed."

While I cant say I noticed the whole building shake, I sure as hell noticed when some one used a few airbomb grenades at the last game I went to down at the Mill. It certainly set off a light vibration in the floor (As It went off on the floor below me somewhere, possibly even two down).

Certainly made me glad I was not in the same room with them. The small ones that were being tossed around did their job quite well enough (when they went off) as I can attest to having been naded in a room with one (Almost made it out in time... by running right into crossfire going both ways, but at least I got the bastard that threw it in! :D )

I dont recall them calling out grenade either, just the delay from when he poped up first and I shot at him and then poped up again told me he was gonna throw one since I knew they were being used.

I can also understand why people use them. I've been eyeing the AI grenades, but god damn I just cant justifiy over $100 a pop at the moment, even if they are reuseable.

The AI grenade is not suitable for large, dark and derelic building that has a lot of trash and holes on the ground.

I'd hate to toss it in a hole and never find it again.

Disposable frags are the way to go IMO. Especially for outside.

Well it seems a few trends are emerging here.

Explosive pryrotechnics are mostly frowned upon. In some cases when used by game admins to produce a battlefield effect it's OK by all and sundry. In cases when someone tosses a dixie cup of gunpowder out blind they're begging to have their balls kicked up to their chin.

Gas powered grenade sims are more acceptable but too expensive right now for most for something that gets tossed and could get lost. Also no one wants to be clouted in the head though by a couple pounds of alloy even if it has a little rubber sleeve. Indoors the noise generator types are not popular on the catching team as what would be considered a safe distance from the sound can't be achieved in a confined room. If some one's got them though they'll be tossing them regardless of the chance of injury.

Guys that throw sticks, rocks or handfulls of BBs can be ignored.

So to sum up;

Stuff that makes a makes a fire and bang should be avoided. Pyro used in movies etc follows a rigid safety procedure that won't transfer well the the fluid and random typical game. Just because you've built a bunch of ones that worked doesn't mean the next one won't take one of your fingers or burn the skin off your arm. When used by a game admin in safe and staged way it may be OK but it's not something you'll learn how to do safey by watching Mythbusters.

Frag and noise simulators when used in a game need to be discussed prior to the game so all players are aware and the MED and other safety rules can be cleared up before the red mist goes up. Something similar to what folks agree on for shower shells.

Letting your team know you're tossing by yelling grenade will make sure they don't walk into the explosion, and it can scare the folks on the other end into giving up ground. Right after you throw you should assault.

YouTube - Airsoft CQB In Melville

Here's video of the pyro grenades going off..

skip to 5:30, You can see how everyone is in the spawn room (I'm the guy in the skull painted mesh mask)

I still have hearing damage from that.. Every once in a while my ears will just start ringing.

Home made pyro = no thanks.

Dizie cup of gunpowder? Sheesh, I'd be more worried about the fumes of it going off than the "poof!" of the gun powder making.

I agree with Amos to a point, the airbombs shouldn't be used indoors at all, they are far too loud. Outdoors is totaly fine though and quite fun without any risk. And overall I find way too many softies around complaining "What it if goes off under a player's ass?"...... well, situational awareness is a good skill to have, and is required in this game of airsoft that we play. We deal with more dangerous toys regularly, upgraded AEGs and such, than anything an airbomb charge can do (a local guy had an airbomb grenade go off in his hand last year, his hand was numb for about 30mins, but he was still able to do well at his TKD tournament that evening) I'd be more trusting of an airbomb spraying me with BBs/dry peas than an AEG shooting me same distance.

When I had my hand in designing these things, we'd set up foil pie tin plates around the grenade in the snow and check for penetration of the dry peas through them, and while there were a couple penetrations, for the most part all we found were just mild dents, so if something will barely go through a piece of thick aluminum foil at a distance of 1 foot............ and the blast did make a couple fall over.............. overall a non-issue really. As I said, indoors for concussion, they shouldn't be used at all. Outdoors, go for it. If you don't want one of these going off anywhere near you while outdoors, I really hope you wear eye protection when you play badminton too, aand maybe laser tag is too painful for you as well.

Small firecracker inside are enough. With the echo, they are loud enough. In a small room, they are quite potent.

+1 to that. The same fella who had one go off in his hand here in ottawa tossed an airbomb around a corner at the mill with out announcing it , it detonates next to a teammate and i my left ear is till somewaht numb on occasion. Oh and he proceeded to point blank (less that 3 feet away) both of us with a pistol. Not whining just the guy has been a problem with explosives and exhibiting generally assine and immature behaviour when dealing with pyro.
my 2 cents

For every guy who's saying it's only XX firecrackers in a casing there are just as many trying to get mother nature to piss her pantsuit.

Happy to cut open fireworks and so on to give it a few more spoonfulls of powder untill they get knicknamed Joey 7 fingers. Or they wind up popping someone's eardrum or giving them flashburns.

hehe BW2 i wasent even there but when the windsor guy told me bout the nade that they threw annd how much shit went down i made them blow me up while i was in a building.... it was right a t my foot when it went off... BARELY made my right ear ring and i was right there.... out side yea why not as long as you dont start a fire.....

FK HIT...


these are the toliet paper tubes with tinfoil and peas??? yea id get some more for outdoos in a heart beat... these AI nades (i know they are not for outdoors) but the timer is way off... even for the DD kit...(also not loud enough for 14 bucks +ship...

I can see how the airbomb nades can be nasty inside and shouldn't be used, but I don't see them as a problem outside. I had one one of the Warmonger grenades land a couple of feet beside me (friendly fire at that - thrown, hit a branch, bounced back and landed beside me) while I was prone on the ground. I suffered no hearing effects and the peas didn't even hit me.

As for inside, I don't see small firecracker-based nades as being a problem. And I really don't think that it's necessary to call out the grenades indoors beyond a "fire in the hole" warning to your own teammates when tossing one in a room. I can't see such small nades being hazardous in any way.

I personnaly find the little rockets too dangerous (which is why I didn't want to take any when your friend offered them to me). Never had any bad experience with them but a fire rocket flying all over the place and coming toward you can't be totally safe...

Yeah the rockets were a one time thing. They were left over from another project and we shot them for effect. We won't have those at an indoor game anymore.

I was asking about the reusable grenades that we made. I don't think they were any louder than yours (we just didn't have any duds;)

On that note, I don't think they should have to be called out when thrown. Since very few people get "hit" by them, it's best to use them as a flashbang style by throwing them and then charging in behind them to shoot the startled player. But as we can see here, the area of conflict is how loud is too loud. I suggest we leave it up to the game host of the day, if you have new grenades that the host has never seen.. be prepared to test one or two of them for him.