Airsoft Innovations impact grenade catches on FIRE!
 

So I was at Siege Airsoft tonight. I through my Airsoft Innovations Tornado grenade around a corner and whatched a giant fireball 4 to 5 feet in diameter. After the fireball! The game was promptly stoped. The Tornado still had a little flame comeing out of the bb ejecting port. the size of a candle flame. fortunetly there were several gopro's recording at the time . But now I'm down a tornado, and was woundering what people's experience has been with AI's and the likelihood of getting my tornado replaced? The fire ball was pretty amazing though!

Footage...https://youtu.be/GIF-P1CuM0s

Carl did mention something about a flash device, but i don't think this is what he had in mind.

Wow.

I've never seen anything like that happen. Pressurized propane venting plus a spark (static or friction) might result in something like that. But that's at least one in a million since these things aren't made for combustion.

Thats me right beside it. And yes I still have my arm hairs.

That is crazy. Glad nobody was hurt.

I am pretty blown away, I have been around Carl of AI for a lot of years, I have been present when he tested some of his craziest devices that now live in a box labeled "too dangerous" but this, this is nuts! One in a million throws, maybe ten million...

Where did the spark come from? Friction?

Email AI, if you havnt already, they will take care of you, I am confident in that.

Ouch

They will replace it, contact via website and they will open a RMA.

You'll ship it out on your expensive, but they will ship[ it back on their expense.

I had an issue with mine, and the replaced mine with a brand new one, and I asked for a new color shell, and they accommodated!

+1000 awesome points to AI.

Must have been some sort of ignition source right next to it...

softer ferrous metals hitting concrete can cause sparks.
I'd say maybe an AEG motor, but the ignition was right at impact, so most likely something on the ground.

Next time do it with MAP gas, it'll leave a wicked black mushroom cloud XD

Cardinal sin there not filming the point of impact and surrounding area.

Now that's what you call a frag grenade!!!

That was awesome, dangerous yes, but totally awesome.

I hope no one got hurt... but that was totally awesome... I kinda want one now.

I was closet to the impact, although I felt the heat there was not much else to it.

That was pretty cool! As was mentioned, make sure you let AI know. Their commitment to customer satisfaction is top notion. Plus, I imagine that Carl will really get a kick out of it.

i have one and not had the chance to use it yet.

just glad nobody was hurt

I'm wondering if this grenade user manual mention how to use it? Any throwing angle or height restriction? I've never owned any one but just handled and played couple of time during game. It's a heavy weight with rubber covered housing and metal piece on top.

I believe the material design for airsoft GBB gun or device use, must not cause any sparkle when metal to metal contact during blow back action. If not, will catch fire or even explores easily.

On the video, the grenade was thrown to almost 6 feet high and dropped on the concrete floor. I think this incident was causing by the top of the metal part hitting the concrete (concrete could contain with any different materials cause sparkle when having high impact) and the gas released at the same time, this high impact, made sparkle and fired. (That's why I don't like to stand beside aitsofter carrying GBB and smoke at the same time. Something you never know what would happen!) This thread, ppl may talked about how awesome of the fire ball but I think it's time to talk about safety.

I still remember long ago when I was in TTAC, Carl was testing those grenades, we were taught to roll it out and stay low but not throw it high and fall, for safety. Also everyone should know, TTAC is wooden flooring. Now all the arenas are concrete flooring. We should, even must play safe to avoid accident happen. The more safe to handle gas devices, the more fun everyone will has. I wish we all have a safe and fun airsofting environment!

A clear explanation is that the top part of the nade, is made out of aluminium/steel handle. What happens was that the part striked on the concrete causing it to spark. Then while the gas released on impact, the spark ignited the chambers where the bb's fed out from.

Have we considered some sort of polymer coating on these metal parts? To me it seems like powdercoat or a thick bedliner would reduce the risk of this happening.

make the metal parts that are exposed externally out of brass, and you eliminate the chance of a spark.

I don't think this has been a common issue yet.
But that being said, further coating the metal parts would be a good idea.

After having a day to really ponder what the ignition source for the propane. I've come down to two ideas. First and the obvious, that the tornado's aluminum cap created a spark from possible metal particulate on and around the concrete floor. My second theory...I recall seeing a post by BB basterd showing a competitors brand bb's magnitizizing to an aeg motor due to some kind of metal content in the bb. Its a possibility that a bb with metal content could have caused a spark. But I'd lean more to just a random act of awesomeness...
Just to be clear I do don't fault Airsoft Innovations in there design at all. This was probably an extremely random event. Great product all around...Even on fire!!!

Brass is incredibly soft and perhaps not a great material to use on something designed to be thrown around a lot.

Tornados come with a rubber bumper on the protruding aluminium stem that holds the pin. On both impact ant timer grenades. Its there for protecting players from getting beaned by hard metal.

Could have been somone who removed the bumper letting the metalic parts connect with the ground.

Aluminum won't create a spark... so it was probably something on the ground, or in the concrete...Or if the spoon pack was installed, it might be that also...

Aluminum won't, but the steel spoon for the AI is fixed and can cause that.

Really nice to look at, but yeah safety.

I have been using Tornados for years in places way dirtier/likely to have flammables/ignition sources. Never had any issues.

I think the grenade has nothing to do with it, it's environmental factors, and pretty random. Metalic dust on metal reinforced concrete... hit it with a hammer it will spark... that nade probably did just that.

I think the solution is to play with our gear in bubble wrap so nothing can happen XD
Or maybe a cleanup crew to sweep the floor...

AI controls quality production that I agree with.

Players control their habit that the way to handle grenades is a must, IMO. Exercise how to roll it out but not throw it out high, it's a game, no need to throw it high, ALWAYS SAFETY FIRST. Understand it was so exciting during gaming but keep safety in mind would even enjoy better!

Most players yell frag out and lob them into the area, I've been to games here where literally 20-30 grenades are thrown per game... clearing rooms, down stairwells, never any issues. I agree you shouldn't overhand throw the grenade with force but I always underhand lob the grenade like the player in the video. I think it was an extremely isolated event that we can all go "oooo, ahhh" over but calling for a product redesign or changing the way they are commonly deployed is not necessary.

I don't know... even if it's 1 in a million... do you want to be that 1 that has to face a simulation grenade being thrown at YOU that accidentally turns into a real-life incendiary grenade? I would actually look to the people at Seige to inspect the spot it was thrown. Maybe there was some kind of foreign metal on the ground it could have made contact with?

In all likelihood, and coincidences aren't that uncommon, a freak accident like this might actually burn a place down ._.

It definitely warrants inspection of the area and also AI taking a look at the grenade to see if they can spot what went wrong.

As far as taking a chance I would stand in front of a hundred grenades thrown at Siege Airsoft no problem, I am that confident in Tornados that it wouldn't happen again.

I expect AI is on this case like fat kid on a smarty.. Propane propellant is a mainstay in the community and has been used for years without significant incident. ( except for idiots willfully igniting it )

one in a million is still a chance, and product liability is a not a small issue

There was no scorching of the ground to see. Also, the grenade did not explode. The vented propane ignited. You can still see a little bit of flame coming out after it ignited. The person throwing it did yell fragout. I was closes to it but I had my back turned, all I felt was some heat and saw the flash light everything up. To me it looked way worse on film then actually experiencing it.

it's kind of a perfect storm of events, the propane has to atomize correctly for it to ignite.. pure propane doesn't catch on fire in absence of oxygen, so it had to atomize and mix to the correct ratio for ignition, at which point a spark can ignite it.

My solution/suggestion would be to rubberize all outside metallic surfaces so there's no metal to make contact and potentially spark.

You have a better chance to be hit by a falling Sputnik satellite than this thing does in burning a place down.

pretty lucky no one was standing around that corner that grenade was thrown at head height and could have beaned someone before it hit the ground....... one of the reasons AI usually suggests low throws/rolls.


Shocked to see one ignite, been these thrown thousands of times, including by those guys on youtube a few years back who put them through stress tests which included running it over with their truck a few times.

Well actually chances of being hit by a satellite are probably higher than that....

http://www.theguardian.com/science/l...-to-earth-live

Only difference is that you're comparing a satellite that could land anywhere and a commonly thrown simulation grenade that is commonly thrown indoors in a platform made mostly of wood.

The odds are still against your favor.

Wow this is quite shocking to me. I just heard about this post here so i logged in to check it out.

I'm pretty amazed really. The exterior of the Tornado isn't made of anything that spark when impacting concrete or even steel. Nylon shell halves, and aluminum cap is pretty non sparky.

I need to see that grenade ASAP so I can see if I can replicate the feature in next generation products.

Seriously though, I'd like to exchange that grenade with a new one ASAP Foxfels. Hit our contact page to arrange a return. We'll be happy to reimburse you for your costs shipping to us and ship you a new 'nade.

http://www.airsoft-innovations.com/pages/contact-us

Yeah, it sounds and looks completely intriguing and crazy. Looks like they had a spook kit and the spoon sparked off the floor. I can imaging that the coating on the spoon can be worn down from prolonged usage. Bare steel + concrete floor + propane = possible fireball.

Some concrete floors have metal in them. Especially in wear house type places. It created a more durable surface. That's prolly what cause the spark. Aluminum cap hits the metal in the floor causes a spark and boom.

Accidentally throws a flaming propane fireball...

...High-fives all around!

Ive seen many a AI grenade but none as spectacular as that

... Is it terrible that this makes me way more excited to pick up a couple tornados?

In all seriousness, I'm glad no one was hurt. Huge respect to MadMax for offering to reimburse for shipping and swap the 'nade. Sounds like a damn decent guy. Definitely going to buy more of your shtuff.