Increasing VsR fps
 

Hey guys, Blake here, first time poster but long time airsofter. I live up in Edmonton and over the long winter I'd like to upgrade the fps on my VsR to as close to 500 as possible.
Currently I have:
TM VsR 10 G-Spec
303mm Laylax tightbore
Laylax spring guide
Laylax m150 spring
Laylax Teflon cylinder
Laylax Air Seal damper cylinder head
Laylax zero trigger
9ball hopup bucking

It shoots on average 460 fps +- 3 fps. What should I be looking at upgrading/replacing.
Thanks!

Well to answer your question, the spring. You change the spring.
And if you feel you need more accuracy, firefly hop rubber.

More importantly;
1) Why do you feel you need an extra 40fps?
2) What weight of ammo do you plan on running?

Watching this thread.

1) Just looking to outdistance AEGs. AEGs are limited to 375 at our club while spring rifles are limited to 500 fps. I'd like to use a heavier weight bb whilst still outdistancing AEGs.

2) Weight's negotiable. I've got everything from .2s up to .43s I think. I just play around until I find something I like.

What makes the firefly hop rubber more accurate than the 9ball? From the research I did initially everyone seemed to recommend 9ball.

whatever floats your boat, I used the firefly to really great effect

But seriously, if you're already 80fps above AEG's, and you're still not getting sufficient range over them, an extra 40fps isn't going to produce much of a difference.

I've personally seen, on more than one occasion, a few 330-360fps guns out range 380-470fps guns.

What's critical in range and accuracy is BB weight matching your fps (which you should be using .36s right now), compression and seal, barrel and hop quality.

With your current setup you should be getting at LEAST 260ft of range, and able to hit a guy at 200.
With my VSR at 430fps, using .30s, I was ranging out to 240 at best, and able to hit people out at 200.

I just want to make sure your system is actually working before you go needlessly increasing your fps to try to compensate for a problem that isn't fps related.

Now all that being said, with the new Rhops and polarstars and some other great AEG parts coming out, their range is increasing as well. My PTW is pretty damn close to par with my old bolt action. You might just have to adjust your tactics. Unfortunately this isn't real steel where a bolt action rifle has double the effective range of an assault rifle...

Yeah all these unfortunate realities have discouraged me from getting a bolt action and after I got my AEG to reach out to around 220ft Ive decided what's the point? My AEG is worth $400 and for a bolt action to get up to that range with the same accuracy would cost double that

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

Hmmm, Ok I get what you're saying. I'll give it another go this weekend and really pay attention to my ranges. Maybe you're right and I'm actually putting out to 260 ft and just not really noticing it.


It's more about the style of play. Sneaking around, finding a good prone spot, observing, etc. I realize you can do this with an AEG but the bolt actions force you to play smarter. Also, my G-Spec is dead quiet. Unlike the unmistakable whir of an AEG or pop of a gas gun, the single shot that comes out of the G-Spec won't give my position away.

I agree with Blake.
It's not really about the money being spent, it's about having to conform to a different style of play.
Dead silent shots, not necessarily long range (majority of my kills were 60-160ft), and extreme accuracy.
The disadvantage of having to manually reload really helps you plan out an engagement, and those valuable skills translate over VERY well to using a DMR AEG

Well, seeing your part list, especially the M150 spring, I would start with a complete disassembly and tune of your rifle.

Right now you are shooting a good 50-60 fps under what that spring should push. That means you either have a bad spring or your leak air everywhere.

Do some research on cylinder to barrel volume balancing. Your cylinder is very over volumed for a 303mm barrel.

Your bb is leaving the barrel before your piston finishes its full stroke not allowing you to achieve as much pressure as you would otherwise be able to achieve. Thus even after your bb has left your piston is still moving and pushing the excess air out of your barrel.

Proper balancing will ensure optimal an optimal piston stroke and will get you your other 40fps when done properly. And if you thought your rifle was quieter before then you're in for a treat!

Or just a stronger spring.

IF you have the Laylax piston with the silent shaft installed, you lose some FPS beacuase of that. I don't remember how much FPS, but it's quite a good amount

The silent shaft on the Laylax create an air pocket at the end , near the head to reduce the slapping of the piston
Your rifle shoots quieter, but lose FPS

Not with a G-Spec, since as the previous poster said, there is too much air volume anyway.

The VSR cylinder is good to something crazy like 590mm
But the time the piston arrives at the head vs the time the BB leaves the barrel is actually perfectly timed at around 400mm of barrel.
I never understood how my VSR was so damn silent when I first built it. Had no air brake, only used 1.5" of it's silencer, and it was a flat head piston hitting a hard rubber cylinder head face. Yet you could not hear it fire from 10 ft away.

Oh really? I've never heard about that before. So basically to increase the volume of the barrel I need to increase the length? Won't it stick out of the Gun at that point? I guess the silencer hides a portion. What length do you guys recommend?

You can add a thick sorbo pad to the cylinder head to remove some of the air volume. If you feel adventurous, you can also port your cylinder.

Keep in mind that this extra air volumes allows you to use a wider, more accurate barrel (you will still lose a bit of power) or very heavy BBs. In my G-Spec, with the stock barrel and hop-up chamber, an A+ hop up rubber and a PDI cylinder kit, .20g shoot at 380, .25g shoot at 375, .28g shoot around 370, .30g around 365, .36g around 355. Keep in mind that 355 with .36g is 2.2 joules, the equivalent of 480 fps with .20g BBs.

In this respect, the G-Spec acts like a gas gun, so it should always be chronoed with the BBs the player is going to use.

Now this has me interested as I'm having the same issue. Where would I find a sorbo pad for my gspec.

I had to make mine

Would these work? Which one?
http://www.airsoftstore.ca/index.php...=index&cPath=3

They are not cut to VSR size... the most common for a VSR are these:

http://www.wgcshop.com/wgc2008/main/...&view_choice=c

Question to the more experienced, can you safely stack these in a G-Spec to further reduce air volume?

Is that site ok to order from?

Why would you want to reduce the air volume? My vsr managed to magically be dead silent without an air brake or the sorbo pad with a 430mm barrel.
Adding sorbo is a poor and ineffective solution. It will foul the laminar airflow to the barrel and will cause problems later on. If you REALLY need to reduce the cylinder volume its best to Install an airbrake or make a port. But i really dont see why you'd need to

Wasn't that the solution post above by Drakker? I'm in the same boat as Blakez. Using an M150 spring is only yielding around 450 fps. Fps arguments aside, isn't there something wrong internally with that spring only pumping out 450 fps? If I can find someway to fix whatever's going on maybe I can decrease the spring. My Gspec is pretty much new rocking darn near the same upgrades as Blakez.

well take his word for it or google the appropriate fps for the spring
either way if theres a big air leak then that's definitely what's causing the excess noise
Mine started to get loud when it started leaking as well.

The key here is 430mm... the G-Spec has a 303mm barrel, so the huge amount of excess air is akin to a leak, it allows the piston to accelerate further once the BB is out and make a lot of noise. Either you port the cylinder or you get rid of the excess air using other means, such as sorboes. This is why I was asking if it's possible to stack the Laylax sorboes, it seems like an easy way to remove air volume. It would kind of act like the PDI short stroke cylinder head (now discontinued). But I wonder if the deformation of the sorbo pads at impact could bend/break the piston air break or affect the airflow.

In my case I have two VSR10, a cheap clone TSD with a 509mm barrel and a King Arms cylinder set that is dead silent (with the piston air break removed, replaced by a screw), and my Marui G-Spec with a PDI cylinder kit. With the PDI metal piston it is as loud as an AEG if not more. With the King Arms piston (a clone of the Laylax piston, but with a smaller diameter equal to the PDI piston) it is MUCH quieter, but still far from silent. The piston air break probably doesn't work well with the PDI cylinder head due to its conical air canal, but the rubber pad on the piston head does marvels to quiet the rifle.

Anyway, that's my experience. As far as I know, both of my VSR have good seal as they have very stable FPS output, so I would think that it's not responsible for my G-Spec's noise.

I had a G-spec.
The stock silencer covers all but 1.5" of the barrel, and it was dead silent using only 1.5" of the silencer, so you don't need the full length of it anyway.
Just put a 430mm barrel in the G-spec. Not like anyone ever takes that silencer off anyway lol

So just to make sure I understand. The 430mm fits the g-specs? But the barrel sticks into the silencer? Does the silencer still work at that point? Which barrel did you use?

Actually, I never use the silencer... I want a short rifle. Why pay more for a G-Spec if you are going to use a longer barrel and lose the size advantage?

Yes it fits, yes it sticks into the silencer, yes the silencer still works, and it was a laylax 6.03

If you use it as a short rifle, then you have your own problems to worry about lol
Just google short stroking VSR, I know amos short stroked his to about half the normal pull

Will look into that, thanks. I wish Amos was still around and would pop in this thread, but he hasn't posted anything for months.

I liked the look of the G-Spec :)

Thanks Thunder

Any word on these?
http://m.redwolfairsoft.com/item_det...10+%28430mm%29

Tanio Koba twist 430mm

Fair enough. ;)

The TK barrels work best at 1 joule of power, that's around 330 fps with 0.20g BBs. If you increase the power beyond 1 joule, you start losing accuracy and fast. They are best used for low power CQB setups. They work *amazing* in gas pistols.

The TK twist barrels work exactly the same way as a widebore barrel. They float more air around the BB to get it centered faster. The rifling is really unnecessary since we're using spheroid ammo, and you REALLY don't want rifled sidespin on it, you only want spin in 1 axis from the hopup.

Just get the laylax barrel if you want to follow my specific build, my advice at this point would be; don't try to improve on a build that's already proven to be extremely successful

Also, as useful as amos was with his intricate knowledge of tweaker parts from japan, I miss having his steady supply of customers come to me a month after he fixed their guns lol

Yeah so I've heard. I'm currently putting on into my 1911 :) Looking forward.



Thanks for all help guys, I hope this helps out Blakez too haha, we seem to have hi-jacked his thread lol