Puzzled over my ICS Sig 551 miss feeding?
 

Just recently purchased an ICS Sig 552...not new but used.
Anyway, the problem is that it shoots 10ft and also jams. When I shoot upside down it shoots great, sometimes a double BB in full auto. The minute I right it up again and shoot, same thing, it only spits out the BB. I'm puzzled and any advice and help would be appreciated.

Sounds like the hop-up is dialed full on. Make sure it's off. Failing that, make sure the rubber isn't damaged.

Yeah I checked the hop up, is was dialled all the way down and its a new rubber bucking. still puzzled as too why its doing this.

Is something loose inside? If turning it upside-down rectifies the problem, a part may be out of sync. I can't think of anything else if the hop is tuned.

Or maybe the BB's aren't going far up enough into the barrel and are hitting the side when being blown by the piston, and turning the gun upside-down helps them chamber properly.

My two guesses. :\

This would have been useful information to include in your OP ;)

Along with JLiang's post, nozzel to hopup misalignment would be my next guess. Check both for signs of impact. Does it have an aftermarket hop-up unit? I had one gun that misfed and double-fed like a bitch on an aftermarket hopup. It did the same after I installed a tightbore in the OEM hop-up.

Also, just a random possibility, have you tried different BBs and different brand of mags? Long shot but I've seen problems caused by mags or BBs that a gun for some reason takes a disliking too.

That's also a possibility. Some BB's are, for example, 5.95 mm in diameter, while others are 5.8 (REALLY crappy ones I saw at a dollar store once. It actually said "5.8mm BB Pelats" In that exact wording. :P ), and even others, 5.99 mm. BB to BB differentiation occurs, too, but as you said that you did this multiple times, I'd assume that's not the culprit.

Also, are you using Mid/LoCaps or HiCaps? Sometimes, guns have a preference on mags, too.

Alrighty, I'll check all your advice and possibilities and let you guys know. I don't think its an Aftermath Sig (jing gong) because I tried to replace it with one and it doesn't even fit. And Kalnaren, sorry I didn't state all my variables.

what bbs are you using? have you tried different brands?

maybe its the mag? weak mag spring not pushing bbs up? or its binding in the mag?

Yeah this one is a real puzzle.
Tried different BB's ( Ksc, elite,
Tried different mags ( TM and Mag brands - Hicap and Midcap )
Tried different bucking, shredder, nub. hop up is dialled all the way DOWN
Tried new barrel tight bore
Tried looking down the the BB well and the nozzle goes all the way back, I can drop one BB in it and it shoots perfectly upside down!
Could it be the previous owner put in the wrong nozzle?
I don't know how that would effect it upside down. Help, whimper.

SIG thread!?

What brand of magazine is this problem occurring with?

both Tokyo marui Midcap and MAG brand Midcap, and both of them work perfectly in my friends ICS SIG 552.

I had similar problem. In my case it was the screws that attached the grip to the mechbox, had become a bit loose inside. So sometimes the motor wouldn't engage fully, causing misfeeds, and double feeds.

Take your hopup unit out, and look from the back (or where the bb enters), it should be a nice and round opening... if its a little oval, then that might be the cause of your misfeeding!

Had the same problem with my SRC hk416 and same symptoms back in the days, thats because aftermarket hopup rubbers are packaged in small bags and get squished , making them oval... :S

BTW: does semi auto work?

Might also be a work out tappet plate, or the nozzle not sealing properly with the hopup rubber....

I would think so ^

the main causes of this problem originate from:
Air nozzle (too short or too long)
Hop up Bucking A.K.A. rubber (is shredded deformed or ripped)
hop up chamber
Magazine not providing enough umf to get the bb into the chamber properly...

other than that i would take a look at your tappet plate just to be sure.

Ok, I replaced the nozzle
change the tappet plate
replaced the the hop up bucking
tried 3 different mags
hop up dialled wide open and gradually dialled down
gearbox fires smooth
All this and still the Same problem, shoots great upside down in semi. Shoots like shit right side up
BB's roll out, or spits them out, shoots out two or jams.

Sooooo baffled by this.

That's very strange. Are you sure the mags are pushing the BBs into the loading tube? Because if you have a half-@$$ed spring in your mag that kinda half-pushes the BBs in, those get jammed. Check the BBs that fall out for signs of wear (E.G. Chips, dents, cracks, etc.) because that's a telltale sign that something's misaligned, whether the BB or some internal part(s).

Are you noticing any chips of BB's coming out when it double/multiple feeds?

How tightly do the mags fit in the magwell? Does it make a difference right-side-up if you hold the bottom of the mag (pushing up) while firing?

Are you sure the mags are locking in properly? With the ICS SIG, you can get a click and a lock without the mag sitting properly.

I have a similar problem, but I have yet to test whether turning the gun ud will correct the issue. Please forgive my n00b post, as I just switched from paintball and tippmans to Airsoft.

I purchased my ICS 552 used, but in great conditions. The gun has probably fired about 10,000 rnds, no more. It worked perfectly with a Nunchuck 9.6V battery, but I had to tape it under the handguard which was ugly and uncomfortable. Lately, it misfired a little. Once every 100 rnds perhaps.

Got a triple cell 11.1 12C Li-Po for it a month ago (only 3ple cell available since the FoxConn factory fire). The ROF went through the roof, WHEN IT ACTUALLY SPITS A BB. It will sometimes spit 15 bbs, and then misfire a whole lot. Winding up the mag a LOT when it does that sometimes improves the feeding. Sometimes it doesn't.

I only have the original HiCap mags. If I slide the output tab whilst wound, both will spit out half the staged bb's. I do not know it this is OK or less than optimal.

Last night I opened the gearbox, and all the metal gears seemed to be teethed right, with little or no detectable wear. I did notice there were no bushings, just washers, which seems to be by design. There was little grease on them so I added just a bit of vaseline to the gear teeth, and some silicon lube. Then squeezed a 2 second full auto burst, and it fired ok.

Today, went to the field with both batteries in, and the next Li-Po burst was a dud. Misfired half or more of the shots. The 9.6 fired much slower, and much more reliably.

I've read that the ICS stock mags are crap, and I should get me a MAG or TM mags, file them down, and try them on.

Before I go an order some mags, does this sound like a mag problem to anyone please?

Thanks in advance for any helpful replies.

Way back when I had an ICS 552, I found the highcaps were garbage. As with all highcaps, really, but the SIG oneswere exceptionally bad. I was lucky to even have BBs coming out of the barrel with them. I've never had a Marui magazine misfeed at all once it's been properly modded for it, though.

I'm a big fan of the G&G mags now, since they have this amazing little follower. I guess I'm easily impressed.

@ tarobear, how do you properly mod the TM mags, maybe thats the problem. I did shave the nib that held the BB's from shooting out and thats about it.
I still can't get mine to shoot properly even after ordering a new Hop up....I thought mine maybe warped since it only shoots upside down.

To be honest, the first mags I had modded when I still had an ICS was done by a gundoc. Later on, a buddy did them for me. It's been a long time since I've sold the ICS SIG, but if I recall correctly, the ICS mags are "reversed" from Marui magazines. Compare a stock Marui magazine and an ICS magazine and you'll see what I mean. From what I understand, you can disassemble the Marui magazine and sort of flip the top around, then shave it down a little. Don't hold me to it, though.

I think I'm finally at the point where I'd be comfortable taking apart my own mags, but fortunately, G&G SIGs seem to be able to accept both types of mags, so I don't need to.

I'm not 100% certain but I believe the ICS sig has a proprietary nozzle, I think it's slightly longer. If it's been replaced that could be the issue.

Edit* I know you were talking about Marui mags but this is how I got my mag brand mags working nicely in my ICS sig if it helps.

http://www.airsoftcanada.com/showthread.php?t=117937

Ultimate solution: Buy a G&G instead :p

No way... you can't beat the ICS for the price they're going for these days. You'd have to be nuts to buy a G&G either that or live in Saskatoon :D

Open up a mag????
 

@Taro: Uggg, I have seen a couple broken mags and I'm not sure I want to deal with the prospect of a mile of loose spring coil... :eek:

@Styrak: I think I'd buy me a Magpul Masada before going with the G&G Sig.

@Kozzie: Yes, I saw a Youtube video where they compared TM vs ICS gearboxes, and everything but the nozzle and hammer were the same. The TM plunger had holes in it and the ICS nozzle was longer.

So in summary, does anyone sell mid or lo cap mags for ICS Sigs?

According to their website ICS makes lo-caps but I've never seem them for sale anywhere. Just get the mag brand 100rnd midcaps. It takes all of 2 minutes per mag to mod them and it's dead simple. The G&G are supposed to be better but I haven't had the pleasure of getting my hands on one.

A G&G is much higher quality. But I digress.

I'm goin to have to go with Styrak here. I used to stand by my ICS until I got my GG. Miles different.

Puzzled over my ICS Sig 551 miss feeding?
 

I had a similar problem, in fact the exact problem. In my case what I found out was that the nozzle was not lined up exactly straight in the hop up. The nozzle was off a bit to one side touching the top part of the hop up, I changed the piston head and added a sector gear delayer and the problem was fixed.
Hope that helps, good luck with it.

Ok, I'll try changing the piston head. Haven't done that yet. Done the delayer though.

:p elitest :)

Eureka! I changed the piston to a longer nozzle-with sorbo pad, and switched the nozzle to a new Sig nozzle. Now she shoots 375 fps with .25's consistently. Thank you Doubleagent for pointing that out. It solved the problem

I must opened up that gearbox at least 12 times. And fiddled with the hop up at least 20 times. I'm so excited I think I'll go play with myself now.

@Shocktr00per,
I discovered this guy and he gets me pretty much any part i need from ICS, so I know he can get those lo-cap with fake bullets or Hicap mags. Seeing as you are from USA, I don't know whether you can get the fake bullet mags in or not. In Canada we can't get them through customs so I didn't bother. In any case the parts may not show up on the website but just contact them...they contact you again by email and you just have to ask. Anddd shipping usually only takes 5 days from china. Try it out, you won't be sorry. Oh, and I'm not related or a friend, just love the service.

http://gunartairsoft.com/

I had another problem with the ICS not shooting. After putting on the hand guards, it shot like shit again. I discovered the weight of the hand guards angled the outer barrel downwards by a minuscule amount that it made a difference in the nozzle lining up properly with the hop up. Thus causing the gun not to shoot properly. Once I put a "gear shim" under the outer barrel, its shooting great in semi and full auto.