Airsoft Canada
http://triggerairsoft.com/shop/

Go Back   Airsoft Canada > Discussion > Upgrades & Modifications
Home Forums Register Gallery FAQ Calendar
Retailers Community News/Info International Retailers IRC Today's Posts

Very interesting developments in solid state AEG control

:

Upgrades & Modifications

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old June 9th, 2007, 03:09   #1
MadMax
Delierious Designer of Dastardly Detonations
 
MadMax's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: in the dark recesses of some metal chip filled machine shop
Very interesting developments in solid state AEG control

Some very interesting work is being done on control systems for AEGs here:

http://forums.airsoftmechanics.com/i...hp?topic=648.0

Waaay beyond the MOSFET triggers we sometimes think about. Gandolf has been working with microprocessors to develop interesting possibilities in shot counting. Of key interest is a method to count pole switching (electrical commutator switching) as a method to count shot cycles by counting armature revolutions. Very high tech for airsoft.

In the later posts, he shows of how his control cct is able to amplify high frequency signals to make an AEG motor make sound like a speaker. Check out the audio files he links to.
__________________
Want nearly free GBB gas?

MadMax is offline   Reply With Quote
Old June 9th, 2007, 09:59   #2
Lakonian
kos
 
Lakonian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Wherever.
Cool, now all we need is a reliable V2.
Lakonian is offline   Reply With Quote
Old June 9th, 2007, 11:11   #3
bean
2 Cent Tactical
 
bean's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Send a message via MSN to bean
there was one it was made by mt haynes. There is one for sale in the general arms bazaar at classic airsoft
__________________
bean is offline   Reply With Quote
Old June 9th, 2007, 13:40   #4
mcguyver
 
mcguyver's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Northern Alberta
Electronic control of AEGs is not a new thing. Marui tried it once with the basic burst chip for the 550/551 and Systema uses quite advanced electronics to control their guns. However, these guns will not run as designed without the electronics and failure of any part of the electronics will render the gun unusable.

Using commutator pole reversal for shot counting is intriguing, but for the average AEG repair tech or end user leads to a simple problem, gear change. If you alter the gear ratio of the mechbox (going from standard ratio to torque-up or high speed) renders any counting useless and inaccurate. The only way to combat this would be to count revolutions of the sector gear using an IR emitter and sensor and drilling a hole in the sector gear. Then no matter what ratio you use for gears, you will always get the correct counting occurring.

That's the way Systema does it for the PTW in order to give 3-burst or full auto or both with a simple mod. It could also allow for proper gearbox stoppage at the end of full auto firing and then for semi-auto to eliminate the initial spool-up time if the gearbox doesn't stop at the optimium spot in the cycle to allow for a near-instantaneous fire when the trigger is pressed.
__________________
Age verifier Northern Alberta

Democracy is two wolves and a sheep discussing what's for dinner.

Freedom is the wolves limping away while the sheep reloads.

Never confuse freedom with democracy.

Last edited by mcguyver; June 9th, 2007 at 14:19..
mcguyver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old June 9th, 2007, 13:43   #5
The Saint
 
The Saint's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Quebec
Good to know that airsoft science continues to advance towards my list of desired features.
__________________
"The Bird of Hermes is My Name, Eating My Wings to Make Me Tame."
The Saint is offline   Reply With Quote
Old June 9th, 2007, 14:16   #6
roughshadow
Banned
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Richmond Hill
I was acualy looking into alot of stuff like this. O wow this guys taken some of my intechens and taken them to the next level. Hes acualy able to complease some. Where as i hadent gotten that far. Only far as to say the abbility to use a 12 volt to power 8.4. and thats still in testings. Drules. My latest toy is closer to reality now then ever before.
roughshadow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old June 9th, 2007, 14:20   #7
Dark-Angel
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Quebec -> montreal
yeah i saw that article, giving me ideas for a fully electronic controled system. my 3 main concernes are, how much space do i have to fit it in my AEG, and proffing it againts water and finaly heat dissipation.

what i would do it, anti dry fire, ROF controled system, automatic decompressing spring system, and various counting system, like total shots, how many shots are left in the mag....
Dark-Angel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old June 9th, 2007, 14:33   #8
MadMax
Delierious Designer of Dastardly Detonations
 
MadMax's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: in the dark recesses of some metal chip filled machine shop
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcguyver View Post
Electronic control of AEGs is not a new thing. Marui tried it once with the basic burst chip for the 550/551 and Systema uses quite advanced electronics to control their guns. However, these guns will not run as designed without the electronics and failure of any part of the electronics will render the gun unusable.

Using commutator pole reversal for shot counting is intriguing, but for the average AEG repair tech or end user leads to a simple problem, gear change. If you alter the gear ratio of the mechbox (going from standard ratio to torque-up or high speed) renders any counting useless and inaccurate. The only way to combat this would be to count revolutions of the sector gear using an IR emitter and sensor and drilling a hole in the sector gear. Then no matter what ratio you use for gears, you will always get the correct counting occurring.

That's the way Systema does it for the PTW in order to give 3-burst or full auto or both with a simple mod. It could also allow for proper gearbox stoppage at the end of full auto firing and then for semi-auto to eliminate the initial spool-up time if the gearbox doesn't stop at the optimium spot in the cycle to allow for a near-instantaneous fire when the trigger is pressed.
A lot of the work on AM is not intended for the average repair tech. Gandolf is doing everything open source for the hackertech who wants to dig in and tweak their code. Really it's a simple matter to spec a gearing to determine the pole count. Changing pole count is easier via DIP switches or code reburn than having to swap out a sector gear and mount a IR gate. I don't mean to knock the Systema setup. They've taken the opportunity to develop their AEG from the ground up. Drop in burst fire counting a much more difficult task.

I've had a TM SIG551. It's burst feature while novel was not consistent. Open loop delay doesn't work out to be reliable when the battery changes charge capacity. It also goes funny when you put in a higher voltage battery. Pole counting offers positional control via braking and slow run without having to mount sensors.

That and you can make your gun actually say "All your base are belong to us" when you switch it to full auto.
__________________
Want nearly free GBB gas?

MadMax is offline   Reply With Quote
ReplyTop


Go Back   Airsoft Canada > Discussion > Upgrades & Modifications

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Airsoft Canada
http://triggerairsoft.com/shop/

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:31.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions Inc.