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Spring Comparison Chart - Updated April 1st, 2006

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Old February 24th, 2004, 00:51   #1
ILLusion
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Spring Comparison Chart - Updated April 1st, 2006

With the proliferation of so many AEG main springs available to choose from nowadays, it is not so simple to pick a spring from either SystemA or PDI.

Now there are springs by SystemA, PDI, Guarder, KM (Head 1950), Prometheus, Top Power and Angel with many more to come.

After many hours, of swapping, testing, shooting and recording, I have finally come up with a new spring chart.

http://www.airsoftcanada.com/SpringChart.html


Although not 100% complete, the chart is very near completion and thought that I would post up the results now and will update it as I come across new springs and results.

Enjoy.

Last edited by ILLusion; December 10th, 2006 at 16:05..
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Old February 24th, 2004, 01:01   #2
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You should send it to Arnies. Many people must find this info helpful, and everyone will appreciate your work
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Old February 24th, 2004, 01:06   #3
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Brian, if you're still looking for a Brand New PDI 170% to test, I have one at my place still in unopened packaging. 8)
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Old February 24th, 2004, 01:09   #4
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Just wondering if you used two or more identical springs for each test. Probably not, as that seems too much to ask for. What i'm getting at is the possibility of an mispackaged spring. From what I can see, the PDI 130% and 140% is basically the same spring?

Were all the springs new when test?

Also, I think it should be noted that we aren't going to get these figures with a stock gun upgraded only with spring and bushings.

Anyways, great work. This will really come in handy when comparing springs. A+ 8)
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Old February 24th, 2004, 01:19   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JAVP
You should send it to Arnies. Many people must find this info helpful, and everyone will appreciate your work
Done.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skruface
Brian, if you're still looking for a Brand New PDI 170% to test, I have one at my place still in unopened packaging. 8)
Thanks for the offer, James, but I actually have one incoming. Cheers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rellik
Just wondering if you used two or more identical springs for each test. Probably not, as that seems too much to ask for. What i'm getting at is the possibility of an mispackaged spring. From what I can see, the PDI 130% and 140% is basically the same spring?

Were all the springs new when test?

Also, I think it should be noted that we aren't going to get these figures with a stock gun upgraded only with spring and bushings.

Anyways, great work. This will really come in handy when comparing springs. A+ 8)
All springs were brand new (or very near brand new). Only one sample per spring was used... except for the Top Power 170%. The actual result posted in the chart is from a brand new one, but I had also taken results from one that was 1.5 years old with ~10,000 rounds through it. The results were almost the same as the brand new one.

I didn't see a point in testing two springs as it would take me forever to acquire springs from different batches to test the spread.

As for the mispackaging of the PDI 130% and 140% - I noticed this anomoly as well and it confirms reports that I have read from the past year. The material of the two springs seems to be different, and the 130% was not engineered properly to compensate. The PDI 130% does look like one of those springs that will hold it's velocity for a very very long time.

And you are right. You won't get these results with an otherwise stock gun. Although I am sure you can get close to some of these results with just a longer barrel.
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Old February 24th, 2004, 01:19   #6
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Unfortunately the gun used is a completely upgraded gun so really the only thing that can be extrapolated from the table is how the springs compare to each other... perhaps you should rate them in percent (300fps == 100% or 1J = 100% or something) so people don't think that putting xx spring will give yy fps. Obviously a person with some common sense wouldn't think that, but lets be serious here.

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Old February 24th, 2004, 01:42   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by midgetspy
Unfortunately the gun used is a completely upgraded gun so really the only thing that can be extrapolated from the table is how the springs compare to each other...
This is exactly the point of this chart. To compare springs to each other. If a user were wondering how an Angel 150% spring would compare to his PDI 120%, he would only need to look at my PDI 120% result, compare it to his, then guesstimate his Angel 150% result based on my 120%/150% results.

Quote:
Originally Posted by midgetspy
perhaps you should rate them in percent (300fps == 100% or 1J = 100% or something) so people don't think that putting xx spring will give yy fps. Obviously a person with some common sense wouldn't think that, but lets be serious here.
Exactly. Very serious. I put a lot of thought into how I wanted the data to be published.

I specifically wanted to show the upper end of what springs would achieve. I would rather see users upgrade with a maximum limit in mind, rather than a minimum limit. (Do keep in mind that I can very easily see these results go higher with a longer inner barrel and a tighter barrel). For example, my results for a SystemA M120S is ~422fps. If I were to test it on an otherwise stock gun, my guesses are that it will come in right at around 390fps.

If I were to publicly state that the spring was a 390fps spring - guess what? All the n00bs are going to want to hit that maximum 400fps mark by buying that spring and thinking "well, I'll be okay. I'm just under the local field limit."

But... here's the catch: they get into that "spending mode" (and I know a lot of tinkerers, upgraders, and just plain big spenders know what I'm talkin' 'bout) and they just start buying stuff that they think they "need" or will "upgrade" their performance without fully knowing what the part is capable of. So they add on a longer tightbore barrel for "tighter groupings", a spring guide with bearings to "reduce torsional stress for more consistent velocities", same goes for piston head... and next thing they know, without even realizing it, they have effectively increased their velocity by ~35fps.

I see this happen all the time with people coming to me asking what parts to buy and/or use because they simply have no idea.

Both you and I and a few others know how to carefully read the data, consider it and the conditions and then extrapolate the information we need.
But realistically (unfortunately?), many others don't have that ability.

So like I said, I would rather state the maximum limit, rather than a minimum limit. I'd rather play with a noobie who thinks his gun is shooting 400fps when it's only shooting 375 fps because he didn't thoroughly consider his upgrade path.
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Old February 24th, 2004, 04:03   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ILLusion
And you are right. You won't get these results with an otherwise stock gun. Although I am sure you can get close to some of these results with just a longer barrel.
so you're saying if i have a set of guarder bushings, a stock nozzle, angel silent piston head set, stock piston, and guarder ball baering spring guide, i might have to take around 10-20 fps off the recorded fps because of your set-up? is there any way you could do this test with just the basic set-up (ie spring and bushing)? that test would be great and extremely useful and might just give me an explanation as to why my guarder and systema nozzle keep braking.
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Old February 24th, 2004, 10:10   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TNK
[quote:bcd016ab8f="ILLusion"]And you are right. You won't get these results with an otherwise stock gun. Although I am sure you can get close to some of these results with just a longer barrel.
so you're saying if i have a set of guarder bushings, a stock nozzle, angel silent piston head set, stock piston, and guarder ball baering spring guide, i might have to take around 10-20 fps off the recorded fps because of your set-up? is there any way you could do this test with just the basic set-up (ie spring and bushing)? that test would be great and extremely useful and might just give me an explanation as to why my guarder and systema nozzle keep braking.[/quote:bcd016ab8f]

Uhh... no thanks. I've already spent too many hours doing this. I'm not doing it again.
But.. to be honest, with your setup, your FPS should actually be very very close to mine. You did not mention what inner barrel you are using. A 509mm x 6.04mm tightbore gives a ~6fps increase. A 509mm x 6.04mm SystemA BS barrel only had 4 fps higher than the 335mm x 6.04mm barrel used in the tests.

Use that information to consider your setup.

I try to make the data useful for everybody, but I won't be coming up with every single setup possible and come up with charts for it.

Pay me for my time, for the parts, my roof, my food and lab time and I will consider requests.
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Old February 24th, 2004, 16:23   #10
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Excellent work Illusion, thanks!

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Old February 24th, 2004, 17:26   #11
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hehe, i was just kind going over the line, but thanks a lot for the chart, because i had an M120S, and i guess thats why my nozzles were brking, they were shooting around 415-430
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Old February 24th, 2004, 17:37   #12
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My worries are well founded.

After posting up this chart, I received PMs from guys wanting to "get as close to 400fps as possible on an otherewise stock gun" and they picked out all of the springs that were right at, just barely under or just slightly above the 400fps mark.


Quote:
Originally Posted by TNK
hehe, i was just kind going over the line, but thanks a lot for the chart, because i had an M120S, and i guess thats why my nozzles were brking, they were shooting around 415-430
The power of your spring should not be causing your nozzle to break. You have another issue at hand. Check your cylinder head. The shaft may be crooked.
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Old March 26th, 2004, 20:37   #13
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Any chance you can do the same type of chart for us bolt action guys? I have a 300% in my upgraded CA M24 (pushing average 504fps with .2g BBs) and want to dump it down to 400fps before I get out to play. I am thoroughly confused what to get. I'd rather just buy the right spring than have to deal with trying a few different types, and having to settle (or worse, cut a few coils off) for something that works, but could be better.

Since a good chunk of guys here use bolt action sniper rifles, AI think it'd go over really well if REAL info was available, as those that I have asked have given varying info. I thought maybe a 200% would get me down to ~400fps, but have been told once that even a 200% can spit out close to 600fps.

PDI spring ratings confuse the crap outta me. At least I can assume that FF springs you just add the number to the stock spring fps. If I want to get 400fps out of my '24, an FF150 would add 150fps to the roughly stock 280fps, giving 430ish?
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Old March 26th, 2004, 20:51   #14
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Originally Posted by CDN_Stalker
Any chance you can do the same type of chart for us bolt action guys? I have a 300% in my upgraded CA M24 (pushing average 504fps with .2g BBs) and want to dump it down to 400fps before I get out to play. I am thoroughly confused what to get. I'd rather just buy the right spring than have to deal with trying a few different types, and having to settle (or worse, cut a few coils off) for something that works, but could be better.

Since a good chunk of guys here use bolt action sniper rifles, AI think it'd go over really well if REAL info was available, as those that I have asked have given varying info. I thought maybe a 200% would get me down to ~400fps, but have been told once that even a 200% can spit out close to 600fps.

PDI spring ratings confuse the crap outta me. At least I can assume that FF springs you just add the number to the stock spring fps. If I want to get 400fps out of my '24, an FF150 would add 150fps to the roughly stock 280fps, giving 430ish?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ILLusion
Uhh... no thanks. I've already spent too many hours doing this. I'm not doing it again.
this was in reply to TNK's request to do the test again with ONE aeg spring...
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Old March 27th, 2004, 10:17   #15
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Gotcha. Didn't read fully every single post, just glanced over them. Still, I think it's useful enough that SOMEONE should do something like it. At least everyone that has experience with a certain gun/certain spring to pool all the info together into a small data base.
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